Lian Li PC-TU200: On the Road With Lian Li
by Dustin Sklavos on October 31, 2011 12:45 AM EST- Posted in
- Cases/Cooling/PSUs
- Mini ITX
- Lian Li
Conclusion: Needs to Go Back to the Drawing Board
Lian Li's goals with the PC-TU200 and its intended purpose are both admirable and, in my opinion, realistic...at least in concept. I'm not 100% certain Lian Li could be successful with what they're trying to do without adding an inch or two here and there to the TU200's dimensions, but I don't think it's out of the question either. The all-aluminum design Lian Li is famous for is a great fit for something that's supposed to be a portable LAN machine, and the handle is both sturdy and useful. The TU200 is small enough that the handle is actually practical as opposed to just being a cute idea.
Their central idea in terms of airflow and cooling is a proven if underused one as well: a single large fan, lined up directly with the internal components, can maximize cooling efficiency in ways that many larger cases still haven't figured out how to benefit from (for example, it pays off in spades in the SilverStone FT02 where my i7-990X's core temperatures idle at an average of about 24C.) This is something that we know works well; even SilverStone was surprised at how effective this type of design was in the TJ08-E that basically obsoleted their high end FT03 at about half the cost.
The problem is that parts of the TU200 just feel grossly over-engineered, and as a whole the enclosure needs to go back to the drawing board. If we take the question of whether or not they should stick with an ATX power supply out of the equation, we're still left with the case's biggest flaw: the drive cage. Its bulk makes several ATX PSUs difficult if not impossible to include, and it's not exactly a tool-less design. I suspect Lian Li was trying to make it easy to swap hard drives in and out of the TU200, but honestly I think a lot of enclosure designers tend to overvalue that ability. This case is tiny and meant to be portable, and I just don't think the sacrifices made to allow the end user to swap drives a little more easily are worth it. By just slimming down the cage and using flat-headed screws and silicon grommets the way Antec often does to lock the drives into place, Lian Li can score a little bit more interior real estate.
I also appreciate that you can install basically a grand total of five storage drives in the TU200, but in a case this small that seems excessive. At most I'd want to see enough space for an SSD system drive and maybe two 3.5" drives. Making that change could also potentially increase the interior real estate again and allow for improved air flow from the intake fan. If you were to populate all of the drive bays with the current design using traditional mechanical hard drives, even with the large 140mm intake fan the internal drive temperatures are liable to get dangerously high under load—and that's without adding a GPU to the mix.
Since we're compiling a wish list anyhow, I'd also strongly suggest moving the ports somewhere else, either removing the increasingly less relevant optical drive bay entirely and putting them there or placing them in a row at the top of the case. Placing them at the bottom has two adverse effects: it keeps them a bit out of the way (though I get the feeling the TU200 is meant to be placed on a desk or tabletop), and it covers up space that could be used to ventilate the video card. By moving them, you can potentially increase the size of the intake fan and allow it to grow into the area where the video card is meant to reside, providing it with cool outside air instead of relying on a single vent that threatens to be blocked off by carpet or even just the table the case rests on.
There are enough lessons that can be gleaned from this design that I'm confident Lian Li could turn around and produce a revision of this case that would be able to serve the same purposes while performing worlds better both thermally and acoustically, all at the same cost (if not less). I'll admit I don't think our testbed represents a particularly good combination of components for a unique specimen like the TU200, and that a smart end user could probably build a pretty solid machine in it by very carefully choosing the components used. The TU200 is a very new design for Lian Li, though, and it needs a lot of refinement. $179 is just too much to pay for a rough draft; hopefully Lian Li will produce a second generation design that alleviates the issues this one has. Done right, that one could be a very easy recommendation.
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TheGoodGeek - Friday, November 4, 2011 - link
For reference, the clearances in this case are:VGA Card length: 300mm
PSU length: 140mm
CPU cooler height: 80mm
TheGoodGeek - Friday, November 4, 2011 - link
I've posted complete details of my build in this case along with photos and hardware choices (both wrong and right), on my blog (TheGoodGeek dot Net). A bit too long to post here, but the highlights are: don't go with a stock ATX PSU, get one of the shorter SFF ATX PSUs, and don't throw more wattage at it than you really need. 850W is overkill and will add to heat issues. Definitely find a better quality low profile CPU cooler, not the Intel stock cooler. I prefer the Asus P8H67-I to the Zotac Z68. Maybe Anand has had better luck with their Zotacs than the rest of us, but I just wouldn't trust it. Be willing to adjust your initial build until you get the cooling performance you need. Since my post ~5.5 hours ago, temps have only risen to: 30C CPU, 32C motherboard.JonnyDough - Sunday, November 6, 2011 - link
I'd like to see a slim laptop drive bay instead of a 5.25". No cover is necessary, as that just ads weight and extra wear on my drive gears.I'd also like to see an included or available SOLID 375-550w standard PICO or ATX PSUs with SHORT wiring. Cohort with a brand name we recognize (some companies, ie Silverstone manufacture both cases and PSUs that are of quality, so pay attention if you do).
Another note goes to durability. The black looks nice, but the painted corners will likely soon show wear as the paint comes off. If you use paint, make sure its very durable powder coating. Non-gloss (flat) is just fine. Plain stainless steel edges would do well also. The use of a heavy and thick (so you can barely see through) stainless steel mesh for air intakes or the case sides altogether (like the kind used for customized grills on automobiles) would be superb. I think you could slap together a pretty mean case. I would be willing to fork over more money for something that I know will last me 10 years and a hundred(s) of LAN parties.
Wiring is a big pain when it comes to small cases. as well as getting access to components like hard drives, disc drives, ram, CPU heatsinks. Make it so the PSU and drive bay swings out of the way if you can so that the motherboard is openly accessed. I want everything to fold out on a swivel somehow so I can reach in and replace the motherboard easily.
getback2us - Friday, November 11, 2011 - link
I like the Chenbro ES34069 specs the most.For the given size and 4 x 3.5 slots with a slot for DVD player sounds perfect to me.
A 5.25 bay is essential in many cases when you are trying to dump contents from DVD to NAS. Doing it USB 3 or gigabit port might be another option, but what couldn't be more efficient than a local DVD drive.
The Lien Li PC-Q08 and PC-TU200 are 2 best NAS cases I found next to Chenbro ES34069.
There is 2 another good ones. One by Fractal design and Silverstone SST-TJ08 are 2 close matches for LOTSs 3.5 and at least one 5.25 drives while still being Mini-Itx and compact.
I am always on lookout for compact BIIGG capacity cases.
if anyone knows more, please let me know
cyberkost - Saturday, November 19, 2011 - link
Pros:space for 4 3.5" HDD -- I grew to like RAID10 with 4 HDD
5.25" bay -- full spectrum of ODDs can be used + a host of other 5.25" devices
ATX PSU -- again, easy to find / less expensive parts
Screw-less side panels -- open the case up easily for airflow or temporary hook-ups
Mobo tray -- mobo is NOT on a side panel!!
Compact size / mobility
Cons:
Aluminum feet -- going to scratch / mark the surface the case is standing on
Price -- a bit too high (should be same / similar to PC-Q08 ~ USD120-130)
Silver front fan bracket in a black case -- visible through, not very aesthetic (can be painted, but I'd much prefer anodized from the factory)
Placement / orientation of front panel buttons / connectors -- I think Lian Li should have arranged them in a vertical cluster like on PC-Q08 .. or at least have USB3.0 and eSATA ports oriented horizontally
Neutrals:
Handle .. but it kinda goes with that "luggage" corner design
cyberkost - Monday, December 26, 2011 - link
More of a question: did anyone try to put another intake fan on the bottom using rubber screws? I think it might work / be helpful in the no GPU scenario ...TheGoodGeek - Monday, December 26, 2011 - link
No. There's not enough room with a GPU installed, and I think there are better SFF choices if you're going the no GPU route.n13L5 - Sunday, August 26, 2012 - link
The TU200 case reviewed here is a 25.3 liter case, with:300mm graphics card clearance, which is good, but only 140mm PSU clearance and a pretty poor 80mm CPU cooler clearance.
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The smaller PC-Q08 at only 21.3 liters does better:
300mm graphics card clearance, 160mm PSU clearance, and a not perfect, but much better 110mm CPU cooler clearance.
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What this means is, that you'll be hard pressed to install anything better than Scythe's Big Shuriken cooler in the TU200.
The PC-Q08 can hold a far better Noctua NH-L12 (with 2x 120mm NF-P12 fans) or even a Noctua NH-C14 cooler (with 1x 140mm NF-P14 fan).
Looking at some comparison tests made a strong point for using the NH-C14 cooler: With 2 fans installed, it beats a lot of massive top-end tower coolers and with only 1 fan installed, its still beats some, and it certainly beats anything that fits into small cases.
The Big Shuriken is great for its size at only 58mm high, but it lacks fin surface area to compete when you have 110mm to play with. Result, you get much better cooling in the PC-Q08 than in the TU200. I could not find anything better than the Big Shuriken that still stayed under 80mm height. (if you know something, I'm interested, please let me know)
Economically, the Noctua NH-C14 cooler is also interesting, even though its not cheap: the second fan it comes with won't fit on the cooler in this case, but it can be used as a case fan in the PC-Q08 in two places, and its an expensive, very high quality, silent fan.
The cooler costs 65 Euro with those 2 fans, which separately cost 21 Euro each. So, with the extra, I have to buy just one more 140mm fan to complete the cooling, setting me back 86 Euro total.
If I buy the Big Shuriken instead, it costs me only 42 Euro with its one slimline fan, but I still have to buy 2 140mm case fans, so I would end up with an almost identical 84 Euro total.
Granted, if you don't mind buying cheaper/lower quality fans, this calculation falls apart :)
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Note: the PC-Q08 spec lists one 140mm fan and one 120mm fan, but like many other 140mm fans, Noctua's 140mm fans have 120mm mounting holes and there's enough room around the 120mm cutout in the case to mount them in both locations. Actually, the 140mm cutout in the case could hold a 180mm fan, if you can find a good one, which I found surprisingly difficult...
n13L5 - Friday, September 7, 2012 - link
I largely agree with the reviewer's criticisms but not with some of the proposed solutions.Right up front: the much cheaper (and same size) PC-Q08 is much better thermally, due to a smaller simple drive cage with more perforations, and an additional 120mm exhaust fan at the top, and the greater clearance for CPU coolers of 110mm instead of 80mm on the PC-TU200.
The TU200 drive cage is a major selling point for me, cause once the case is built (only thing that really annoyed me is cable management) drives slide in and out, and they do hot swap.
I've built this with 2012 components: Asus P8Z77-i Deluxe, Intel I7-3770K, Gigabyte GTX 670 OC Windforce, one SSD and one HDD and CL8 Crucial RAM.
Issues:
1) Drive cage should be much more perforated and moved 1/2 inch toward the front fan.
2) Annoying that modular 160mm deep PSUs are unsuitable for this case and 140mm PSUs are generally not available with modular wiring. Antec does make a great 140mm deep PSU series for this case though, the EarthWatt Platinum 450/550/650 Watt at 93% efficiency.
3) Using the Asus mainboard with its vertical power management daughter board makes it impossible to fit a Scythe Big Shuriken, which would otherwise be a good fit for this case. I'm using the awful Intel stock cooler till I find something with a 120mm fan that fits.
4) Related to this, due to no 120mm exaust fan anywhere, a little liquid cooler with radiator is out of the question for CPU cooling too.
5) While the entire floor of the PC-Q08 is perforated for GPU air intake, only the rear section of the TU200 is perforated. If you have a reference board cooler design, your GPU's fan is going to sit 1" from solid metal, cutting its efficiency.
6) Making the case slightly longer, like Dustin recommended may also give enough room for a 120mm exhaust fan behind the handle, so yeah... also, the case wastes some space in height, so the increase in length could be accompanied by a decrease in height. Though I do like that the current form factor makes it look like a guitar amp.
7) Due to the thermal limitations, my setup is much louder in this case than in the PC-Q08. During a stresstest (running Furmark simultaneously with Cinebench R11.5) pushing GPU and CPU to full load, Intel's retarded CPU cooler was howling, followed by a BOD after about 15 minutes. This was no problem in the PC-Q08, it didn't even get noisy.
Lest you think I'm trying really hard to sell you on the PC-Q08, that also has some annoyances: The sides only come off by unscrewing 16(!) screws total, and there is no mainboard tray, the mainboard standoffs are on the right side outer panel. Given how wide that case is, I guess it was about cost cutting, seeing how this case is about half the price of the TU200. But given the TU200's issues, it does make the PC-Q08 look good, even though its drive case is nothing special.
I missed bidding in time on an SG08 on ebay, so I have to wait for another one before I can test that, cause I'm not paying Silverstone 200 Euros for their steel case with a non modular bronze PSU.
n13L5 - Friday, September 7, 2012 - link
Forgot to mention the 2.5" drive issue:With all the little custom parts Lian Li made for the TU200, they could have easily provided a mounting bracket for 2.5" drives that would let them slide & plug right into the backplane.
As it is, you have to mount rubber grommets to the bottom instead of the sides, and then try to fish SATA power connectors through the small openings in the backplane, for which I popped off a cover from the connector to get it through, and after installation, your wires are stressed over sharp edges.
Overall, I'd call the TU200 the case of stressed wires...