TV Tuner Comparisons
How does the NVIDIA DualTV MCE compare with the ATI Theater 550 Pro and All-In-Wonder series of cards? We'll start with power consumption, and we tested each of the three cards at three different states: while the system is idle, while watching live TV, and while recording live TV. Here are the results.| System Power Draw | |||
| Idle | Watching TV | Recording TV | |
| NVIDIA DualTV MCE | 162 | 179 | 189 |
| ATI MSI Theater 550 Pro | 159 | 170 | 175 |
| ATI X1800 AIW | 154 | 172 | 172 |
For reference, the power draw of the system without a TV tuner card installed (excluding the AIW) is 145 Watts. We used an X1800 GTO for the main graphics card with the DualTV and Theater 550 cards, in order to keep the power draws as close as possible to that of the AIW card. We can see from the table that the Theater 550 and AIW draw less power than the DualTV while watching and recording live TV, which makes sense given the DualTV's ability to record two sources as opposed to the other cards' one.
Something else we're interested in looking at is channel switching speed between these three cards, as this is something that can vary between different TV tuner cards. The type of tuner on the card can affect this, and all three of these cards use silicone tuners, which can be slower than analog ones, but take up less space on the board. Interestingly, we found that the AIW had the fastest channel switch time at about one second. The Theater 550 had the slowest channel switch time at about three seconds, and the DualTV MCE was slightly faster than the Theater 550 at about 2 and a half seconds. While three seconds doesn't sound like a very long time at all, it can be a very annoying delay if you like channel surfing.
Between these three TV Tuners, there are some major differences aside from power and channel switching speed. Of course the AIW is a much different solution than the other two in that it is a complete 3D graphics card with a built-in TV tuner. The DualTV and Theater 550 are stand alone TV tuners meant to operate alongside a separate graphics card. Having a graphics card and TV Tuner combined can be good or bad, depending on the personal preference. Some people would rather have the freedom of being able to switch graphics cards while keeping the same TV tuner, while others may prefer the combination of the two in order to keep the extra PCI/PCI-E slot open.
Note that the Theater 550 is available in both PCI and PCI-E X1 versions; at present, it is the only PCI-E TV tuner on the market. Also, the X1800 AIW is a very large part and wouldn't fit very well in a compact system, though to be fair ATI offers AIW cards in a wide range of performance and size. One more thing to note about the AIW cards is that they don't have MPEG-2 encoding in hardware, which means they won't work with Windows MCE. The Theater 550 Pro and NVIDIA DualTV include this feature and work fine with MCE 2005.
The Theater 550 Pro is much more similar to the DualTV MCE, with the major difference being the ability to only record one source as opposed to the DualTV's two. Coupled with Windows MCE, the DualTV's capabilities and ease-of-use outweigh those offered by the Theater 550 Pro and it's included PowerCinema 3 (or 4, depending on which T550 card you purchase) software, but the fact that the DualTV MCE doesn't include any other software is a problem.
Below are some screenshot captures of each of these cards' live video for image quality comparison.
NVIDIA DualTV
ATI Theater 550 Pro
ATI X1800 AIW
We can see that there doesn't seem to be much difference between the quality of the DualTV MCE and the Theater 550 Pro, but with the AIW, the image looks a little sharper than the others. This is especially noticeable in the writing on two of the images. Overall though, the differences aren't that great and all of these cards provide good quality video with live TV. Unfortunately, HDTV isn't supported for any of you that want that feature, but of course the number of HD broadcasts and channels is still significantly lower than the number of standard analog channels.
A simple screenshot doesn't always convey quality as well as a video, so we have also created a BitTorrent share with video samples from the three cards. Download the torrent file, and then use your favorite BitTorrent client. Total size of the videos files is 22.3MB. Note that we have the original MCE generated file for the DualTV as well as a high quality re-encode to standard MPEG-2. (The DVR-MS extension doesn't work with all video players, but it works with WMP10.)
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nullpointerus - Friday, May 19, 2006 - link
First, it was my understanding that MCE cards are sold sans PVR software. Frankly, I prefer it this way because I'd rather not pay the hardware manufacturer for developing crappy PVR software that I'll throw away in favor of something more serious like Sage. So there are people who view the lack of bundled software as a plus.Second, it's hard to understand why companies would be developing new analog tuners right now (at least in the U.S.). When the government-mandated switch to digital TV occurs, each of these analog tuners will require a converter box AND either a serial cable or an IR blaster just to keep working, right?
Correct me if I'm wrong, but you've already said that CableCARD requires Vista, and as we know that OS won't be out until the holiday season or even later (depending on who you talk to). And without CableCARD, there simply aren't any digital tuners for the PC that can completely replace the analog tuners currently in use.
GoatMonkey - Friday, May 19, 2006 - link
There you go.
derekblankmccoy - Sunday, May 21, 2006 - link
For those of us that live here in the first world, we have several dvb-t and dvb-s cards. I have a Sweetspot MCE in my machine, works like a dream, recieves Freeview, and if i want to watch and record 2 differenct channels, I just have to add in another one, simple!nullpointerus - Friday, May 19, 2006 - link
Nonsequitor. nVidia didn't have to enter the analog tuner market; what we're talking about is whether it makes sense to develop new products to enter a collapsing market. Your selective quoting didn't bother to address that.Look, would you buy a 3D card right now if i told you that in six months you'd need an expensive dongle, some luck, and a bit of spare time just to get it to work almost as well as it did when you bought it? It's insane.
I can't wait to see the tech support calls:
techrep: Hi! blah blah blah What can I help you with today?
user: Yes, my TV tuner stopped working a week after I bought it. I can't get no signal on any of the stations. It's all staticy.
techrep: Can you verify that you still have cable on your other TVs?
user: Yes, they're all working fine.
techrep: I'll give you a ticket number. It's 493027583.
techrep: Have you tried reinstalling the drivers?
user: I don't understand what would have changed.
user: Oh, sorry, I'll try that now.
*lost connection*
techrep: Hi! blah blah blah What can I help you with today?
user: Yes, my TV tuner stopped working a week after I bought it. I can't get no signal on any of the stations. It's all staticy.
techrep: Can you verify that you still have cable on your other TVs?
user: Yes, my ticket number is 493027583.
techrep: Oh...wait a sec.
techrep: OK, I'm reading your chat log.
*several minutes pass by*
user: Hello?
techrep: Yes, I'm still here. What software are you using to watch TV on your PC?
user: Windows XP MCE SP2
techrep: Have you tried reinstalling it?
user: No, but I don't think that's the problem. It records OK - they're just static.
techrep: I think you need to reinstall MCE.
user: Isn't there anything else we can try?
techrep: Can you play the files back in Windows Media Player?
user: Just a sec.
techrep: OK.
user: Yes, they play back, but the sound and video is just static.
techrep: I think your system has been infected by a virus. At this point, the only thing you can do is to reinstall MCE.
user: OK, whatever.
*several hours pass by*
techrep: Hi! blah blah blah What can I help you with today?
user: ticket number is 493027583
techrep: Oh...wait a sec.
techrep: OK, I'm reading your chat log.
user: Reinstalling MCE didn't work.
techrep: OK, I think I know what your problem is. In compliance with new FCC rules, your cable provider has switched from an analog signal to a digital signal. The tuner card you purchased last week can't handle the new signal.
user: You mean I didn't need to reinstall MCE? Darn.
user: So how do I update the firmware?
techrep: I apologize for the inconvenience of reinstalling MCE. We're updating our support department on these new cases as we speak.
techrep: There is no new firmware. The tuner simply won't work with a digital signal.
user: What the...? I just bought the damn thing last week!!
techrep: I'm sorry, sir, but it just won't work.
techrep: Some people have gotten it to work by purchasing a serial cable or IR blast.
user: Where can I get one of those?
techrep: We don't provide any support for that.
user: What?! How the **** am I supposed to fix this stupid ****?
techrep: I'm sorry, but we don't support third party products like those.
techrep: Is there anything else I can help you with today?
*lost connection*
What fun.
GoatMonkey - Monday, May 22, 2006 - link
It's at least 3 years away.I would hope that I wouldn't be using any video card for that long.
NegativeEntropy - Friday, May 19, 2006 - link
The mandate in the US to switch from analog to digital is for Over The Air only. Oh, and it is currently set for Feb 17 2009. It has already been pushed back several times. I think the original date was 2002.Cable companies own their networks (line sharing not withstanding) and thus can do whatever they want. Hence your worries will be all based on your provider, unless you're a big user of OTA broadcasting. I don't know about you, but the only people I know that use an antenna are:
1) People that only want 4-7 channels total
2) People that use it for local channels that choose to not or cannot get via sattelite
3) People getting OTA HD (which is analog?)
Trisped - Sunday, May 21, 2006 - link
Of course the fact that my cable company has been tring for years to get us off analog and all onto digital doesn't do much for my desire to own another TV tuner. When they come out with one that does HDTV, DTV, and SDTV and uses a PCIe slot I will start looking into getting it, not before.nullpointerus - Saturday, May 20, 2006 - link
Really? Man, I was terribly confused. Thanks for clarifying that!From what I can tell, OTA HD is digital, not analog. I've read about the signal either being on or off - IOW not staticy - and then there's this site which I found this morning:
http://www.dtv.gov/consumercorner.html#howdoiget">http://www.dtv.gov/consumercorner.html#howdoiget
...which gives advice on how to get OTA DTV.
gplracer - Friday, May 19, 2006 - link
I thought that I read somewhere that the cablecard tuners will only come with systems made by manufacturers. If one is building a computer he/she will not be able to purchase this tuner. I find it hard to believe this will happen but who knows.nullpointerus - Friday, May 19, 2006 - link
Oh, one more thing: As for why there isn't a version bundled with MCE, think of the support issues. People expect software bundled with a piece of hardware to "just work" when it is installed, but having to replace your OS or install it on new hardware? It's just too much work - MS should handle the MCE problems. This would be different if MS figured out that MCE is just an application and should be sold as such. Application solutions such as Sage or BeyondTV often sell software+hardware bundles through their store especially with Hauppauge cards.