Shuttle SN27P2 SFF: AM2 gets the Tiny Treatment
by Jarred Walton on June 30, 2006 11:00 PM EST- Posted in
- Systems
Benchmark Setup
We have upgraded our SFF testbed quite a bit since last review, so we can't directly compare results with previous SFFs. We will be comparing the SN27P2 performance with that of desktop AM2 motherboards for now. If it can more or less match their performance, then the only real question will be whether or not you want to spend the money to get an SFF as opposed to a regular ATX system.
We're providing results for the SN27P2 with an X2 5000+. In light of the fact that the 2x1MB cache Athlon X2 processors are being discontinued (other than perhaps the FX line), we will likely be shifting much of our AM2 testing over to the 5000+ chips in the future. As you'll see, and as we discussed in the past, the faster CPU speed of the 5000+ with slower memory and less L2 cache ends up performing very nearly the same as the 4800+. We have included results from running the Foxconn C51XEM2AA with a 5000+ as well as a 4800+ for reference. The various AM2 motherboards we've tested so far all perform about the same, so the major decision factor will likely come down to features anyway. The key feature for the SN27P2 of course is its size, but noise control is also likely to be a major consideration.
We have also run our benchmarks with a 7900 GTX card as well as a 7900 GT. Either card will fit, but of course if you use the dual slot GTX you do not have any further internal expansion slot options. Whether or not that's important to you will depend on how you want to use the system. TV tuner and sound cards are the most likely use for the single PCI slot in this system, but an add-in sound card may not be necessary for most people, and you can get quite a few decent USB TV tuners. If you are simply planning on using the system as the core of an HTPC, our recommendation would be to grab one of the many fan-less GPUs that are coming to market, probably a 7600 (GT as an upgrade) or an X1600 Pro/XT would strike a decent balance between performance and power/heat requirements. If you don't need the 3D graphics performance, dropping down to an X1300 would also be a good option.
We have upgraded our SFF testbed quite a bit since last review, so we can't directly compare results with previous SFFs. We will be comparing the SN27P2 performance with that of desktop AM2 motherboards for now. If it can more or less match their performance, then the only real question will be whether or not you want to spend the money to get an SFF as opposed to a regular ATX system.
| Performance Test Configuration - Shuttle SN27P2 | |
| Processor: | Athlon X2 5000+ (AM2) |
| RAM: | 2 x 1GB Corsair Twin2x2048-8500C5 DDR2-800 at (CL4-4-4-13) |
| Hard Drive: | 1 x Maxtor MaXLine III 6V250F0 250GB 7200 RPM SATA (16MB Buffer) |
| Optical Drive: | BenQ DW1655 |
| System Platform Drivers: | NVIDIA 9.34 |
| Video Cards: | 1 x EVGA 7900GTX 1 x BFG 7900GT OC |
| Video Drivers: | NVIDIA 91.31 |
| Cooling: | ICE 4G |
| Power Supply: | SilentX 400W |
| Operating System(s): | Windows XP Professional SP2 |
| Performance Test Configuration - Foxconn C51XEM2AA | |
| Processors: | AMD Athlon 64 X2 - 4800+ (AM2) Athlon X2 5000+ (AM2) |
| RAM: | 2 x 1GB Corsair Twin2x2048-8500C5 DDR2-800 at (CL3-3-3-12) |
| Hard Drive: | 1 x Maxtor MaXLine III 7L300S0 300GB 7200 RPM SATA (16MB Buffer) |
| Optical Drive: | BenQ DW1655 |
| System Platform Drivers: | NVIDIA 9.34 |
| Video Cards: | 1 x EVGA 7900GTX |
| Video Drivers: | NVIDIA 91.31 |
| Cooling: | Zalman CNPS9500 AM2 |
| Power Supply: | OCZ GamexStream 700W |
| Operating System(s): | Windows XP Professional SP2 |
We're providing results for the SN27P2 with an X2 5000+. In light of the fact that the 2x1MB cache Athlon X2 processors are being discontinued (other than perhaps the FX line), we will likely be shifting much of our AM2 testing over to the 5000+ chips in the future. As you'll see, and as we discussed in the past, the faster CPU speed of the 5000+ with slower memory and less L2 cache ends up performing very nearly the same as the 4800+. We have included results from running the Foxconn C51XEM2AA with a 5000+ as well as a 4800+ for reference. The various AM2 motherboards we've tested so far all perform about the same, so the major decision factor will likely come down to features anyway. The key feature for the SN27P2 of course is its size, but noise control is also likely to be a major consideration.
We have also run our benchmarks with a 7900 GTX card as well as a 7900 GT. Either card will fit, but of course if you use the dual slot GTX you do not have any further internal expansion slot options. Whether or not that's important to you will depend on how you want to use the system. TV tuner and sound cards are the most likely use for the single PCI slot in this system, but an add-in sound card may not be necessary for most people, and you can get quite a few decent USB TV tuners. If you are simply planning on using the system as the core of an HTPC, our recommendation would be to grab one of the many fan-less GPUs that are coming to market, probably a 7600 (GT as an upgrade) or an X1600 Pro/XT would strike a decent balance between performance and power/heat requirements. If you don't need the 3D graphics performance, dropping down to an X1300 would also be a good option.
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Calin - Monday, July 3, 2006 - link
Most any ATX case will be quiter and possibly cooler inside than one of those SFF computers. However, they will be twice as big (or more). If that's ok with you, that's great - ATX all the way. If not, a laptop or a SFF certainly makes sense (even if the price is much better on the full ATX front).JarredWalton - Monday, July 3, 2006 - link
I don't know - it depends on the ATX case you're talking about and how many fans you want to install. If you install two or three case fans (or more) and they aren't temperature controlled, a lot of the less expensive ATX cases will be louder than many SFF cases. Lower quality power supplies will also make a lot of noise. If you don't want a big case, and you are interested in getting an extremely easy to set up bare-bones system, SFF computers are really very nice.I do wish prices were about $100 lower, however. $300 for a SFF I can justify; $400+ is a lot more difficult to stomach. For that much money, you can get a good power supply, motherboard, and pretty much any case that you want. I suppose part of it has to do with economies of scale; I don't know how many SFF cases Shuttle has sold, but I doubt they sell as many SFFs someone like ASUS would sell motherboards. That means all of their R&D costs that go into creating a smaller case have to be passed on as a larger percentage of the price.
JarredWalton - Saturday, July 1, 2006 - link
There was no opinion given on which CPU to choose, was there? I simply stated (and this is the expanded version) that even if you're going to buy AMD anyway and couldn't care less about Core 2 Duo, AMD has price cuts scheduled for July 24th so you can pick up an X2 CPU for a lot less than current prices. Here's my opinion:Core 2 Duo will be faster than anything AMD has to offer at least in the short term. AMD X2 will cost less at most (all?) price points, and in some cases (gaming), you're probably GPU limited either way since the current maximum for an SFF is going to be the 7950 GX2. I expect Shuttle will have the SD37P2 out some time after C2D launches, but since they're already 1 month behind the AM2 launch and you still can't purchase the SN27P2, that trend will likely continue and the SD37P2 won't be available until probably early September or so. (I could very well be wrong on that account, but I'm simply going by recent history.)
Which is the better choice? As you have so clearly demonstrated, that's a matter of personal taste. Some people are only going to buy AMD at present; others will only buy Intel. Most would like to buy whichever offers the best performance at a specific price point. I would guess that AMD will be competitive in the price/performance area even if C2D is faster overall, so in the end they get what they're happy with. I still wouldn't purchase an AM2 chip until those price cuts take affect.
VooDooAddict - Saturday, July 1, 2006 - link
Simply.
Will the 7950 Fit?
Does the BIOS support the card?
Can the powersupply keep it running with 2 gigs of RAM and a AMD 5000+?
As soon as I saw the 7950 anouncement all I could think about was building a new SFF system around it.
JarredWalton - Saturday, July 1, 2006 - link
I don't have one available, but my understanding is just about any motherboard with an X16 slot will work with the 7950 GX2. Since I managed to install a 7900 GTX in the SN37P2, I'm pretty sure the GX2 is actually a bit smaller overall, so it will certainly fit. Is it compatible? Well, the SN27P2 uses an NVIDIA chipset, so if it's *not* compatible, NVIDIA has a serious problem with support of GX2. In other words, I'm 99% certain that it will work.VooDooAddict - Monday, July 3, 2006 - link
I didn't think the issue was the chipset ... I thought it was the BIOS.JarredWalton - Monday, July 3, 2006 - link
Right, the BIOS needs to support non-graphics devices in the X16 slots. My point is that if a board using NVIDIA's chipset doesn't support NVIDIA's top GPU, what's the chance of getting everyone else to support it?