Buyer's Guide - Entry Level to Mid-Range, March 2005
by Jarred Walton on March 15, 2005 1:30 PM EST- Posted in
- Guides
Displays
For our displays, we continue to stick with CRTs due to pricing concerns. However, our favorite 17" CRT continues to go up in price, so we're placed in somewhat of a difficult position. Cheap 17" monitors can be found, but the quality of such options is never that great. Maximum resolution is generally 1280x1024 with refresh rates of 60 Hz. As price is a major concern for the budget sector, we'll still recommend such a display. However, for a minor price jump, the option to purchase a decent 17" LCD is now there.
Click to enlarge.
Price: $145 shipped
In the past, we have recommended the NEC FE771SB as a slightly more expensive alternative to the Samsung display. However, the price of the NEC displays has now shot up about $20 since the last budget Guide, putting it at nearly the same level as a decent 17" LCD. If you can find the FE771SB for less money, by all means go for it. We are unable to do so - at least, not from any place where we feel that there is a reasonable quantity available. As a less expensive alternative, the Samsung 793DF/MB is still good. Some people prefer shadow mask tubes over aperture grilles like the NEC anyway, but we aren't among that group.
The Samsung display is almost perfectly flat on the inside - in reality, the surface is flat externally and slightly curved on the inside. The MB adds the ability to adjust brightness and color temperatures at the press of a button, which can come in handy for certain games - Doom 3 in particular. Movies also benefit at times, assuming that you're watching movies on your 17" display. Overall, picture quality is good, but if you're doing office work primarily, we feel that spending the additional money for an LCD would serve you best.
Click to enlarge.
Price: $210 shipped
You could always go for a large CRT like the Samsung 997DF, but for non-gaming use, an LCD is probably a better choice. We've selected a good LCD, although not necessarily a great one. Missing is support for DVI input, and of course, you're locked into a resolution of 1280x1024 for best results. However, a 17" LCD is actually larger than a 17" CRT, as the viewable diagonal is 17" rather than 16". A 19" CRT would have an 18" viewable diagonal, making it slightly larger, but then you're dealing with a heavier unit and all of the other CRT aspects. Other benefits to LCDs include the fact that refresh rates are no longer as important, as flicker isn't generally noticed even when running 60Hz, and they don't use as much power as a CRT.
DVI input would make such a display ideal, but that does add at least another $20 relative to the Rosewill. The only real problem remaining with LCDs is the potential for dead pixels. If possible, buying an LCD at a local store and checking it out before leaving the premises is a good way around this issue. Unfortunately, prices and features are often not as good when shopping locally. The warranty of the Rosewill LCD is the one item that gives us cause for concern, as their RMA process looks rather questionable. Still, $210 for a good 17" LCD is about half as much as what such a display cost a year ago!
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JarredWalton - Wednesday, March 16, 2005 - link
38 - I changed to the 9550 after the earlier corrections, as I had a 9600SE initially. I'll fix the text to suggest the purchase of a fanless 9550 and make the 9600 reference more appropriate. Thanks.doganti - Wednesday, March 16, 2005 - link
The article reads:"AGP Graphics Recommendation:MSI Radeon 9550 128MB DDR 128-bit, 250/400 GPU/RAM clock (bulk/OEM)
..
There isn't a whole lot to differentiate the 9550 cards from one another, as they are all fanless.."
I have Asus A9550 GE - Radeon 9550,128MB DDR,128 Bit and it has a fan (which has turned bad=noisy in a month).
Thus, also this is not clear: ".... The Radeon 9600 (without the SE) is also a decent alternative that will only cost an extra $15, and with it, you bump the memory bus up to 128-bits."
JarredWalton - Wednesday, March 16, 2005 - link
31 - If you can afford the bump to Athlon 64 3000+, the MSI RS480M2-IL would definitely be my pick for a board with IGP. Unfortunately, that adds $75 for the CPU upgrade (relative to the Sempron 2600+), but it also improves performance a decent amount. The ATI Xpress 200 is currently the best (BY FAR!) IGP on the market. It gives you S-VIDEO as well as VGA out. Too bad it doesn't have a DVI port as well. :)If that's too much... well, there are a lot of NF2 IGP boards for under $70. The NF2 is probably the better IGP between that and the K8M800 chipset, but the socket 754 CPUs are generally faster. With the price differences between platforms, I'd probably shoot for the Sempron 3000+ on socket A if you go for that platform. (The Barton core is simply the better choice, IMO.) That would compare relatively well with the socket 754 Sempron 2800+ - win some, lose some in benchmarks. I guess it really doesn't matter *too* much if you're not looking for the best performance possible. $150 gets you a decent CPU and mobo for socket A of socket 754, while on socket 939 it only gets you a CPU.
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For the other comments, the PDP isn't great for overclocking, but with a price now at $130 and 2-3-2-5 timings, I'd take the GB of RAM even at stock speeds. If it OCs decently, great. If it doesn't, you should still be fine at stock speeds.
The Hitachi drives may not have the best RMA process, but let's be honest: if you need to use the RMA on *any* hard drive, you'll be very unhappy. I don't think any of the 7200 drives would fail in most systems if they're the only HDD. Just don't put a bunch of them next to each other without proper cooling. At $60 for an 80GB drive, I would probably make backups and if the HDD failed I'd buy a new drive while I RMA'ed the old one. That's just me, though.
Finally, the motherboard area is just such a hard one to give *one* recommendation. Even a recommendation and alternative doesn't really do justice to the available parts. There are so many good boards these days that are all within close proximity in terms of price. If I were looking for socket 939 boards, I'd go as follows in terms of chipsets:
nForce 4 (preferrably not 4X, but any are good)
ATI Xpress 200 (not many available yet)
VIA K8T890
nForce 3 Ultra
VIA K8T800 Pro
ALi/ULi/SiS whatever
I'd go with the top three over the bottom three by a pretty significant margin. K8T800 Pro is now about 9 months old, IIRC. It's still okay, but I wouldn't look to save money by going that route. The nF3 is the same, but it's the better chipset for AGP, IMO. Given the price the K8T800 Pro usually wins out, however.
Messudieh - Wednesday, March 16, 2005 - link
I have the PDP RAM that you mentioned in your review, and I can honestly say that the ability to overclock any one set is sort of a crap shoot it seems. It sounds to me like they use a couple of different types of chips (some being the TCCD chips, while others Infineon) that can all run at the stated 2-3-2-5 speeds, at 2.6 volts in my case.I think I got a set of something other than TCCDs, because I can't overclock them past about 210 with ANY timings on a DFI NF4 ultra-D with a watercooled 939 3000 and keep it stable, even at 3.1 or 3.2 volts.
Like I said...it's a crap shoot; some people get lucky, and others don't. I'm getting this RAM:
http://www.newegg.com/app/ViewProductDesc.asp?desc...
And selling my Patriot to my friend, who doesn't overclock.
Jep4444 - Wednesday, March 16, 2005 - link
oops forgot that the MSI board is 939, either way the Winchester based Athlons are good overclockers anywaysBPB - Wednesday, March 16, 2005 - link
"Semprons K8s are typically very good overclockers so i wouldn't rule out that noones is going to overclock them in a budget machine"Do they make socket 939 Semrpons?
As for me, I went with the MSI ATi based board and am very happy. Put in a 939 3000+, and a Hitachi 80GB SATA II drive. The Hitachi was only $62 at ZipZoonFly. So for a tad more got SATA II (I know, no SATA II controller on this board, but at least the drive has it). The board also has slightly better than average onboard sound, going with the Realtek ALC658C, not the 650 or 655 found in other boards.
Eventually will put a capture card and mid-level video card. I now have a pretty fast system for the price. Oh, went with the 1GB PDP Patriot memory in the article. No problems to report with anything. Very, very happy with the setup.
Jep4444 - Wednesday, March 16, 2005 - link
"The only downside is that the MSI's uATX board doesn't have any OC capability, but who's looking for that in a budget-minded PC?"Semprons K8s are typically very good overclockers so i wouldn't rule out that noones is going to overclock them in a budget machine
razor2025 - Wednesday, March 16, 2005 - link
Why no mention of MSI Neo4-F? It's less than the Chaintech @ $95 shipped at ZZF and it has same PCB as the Neo4 Platinum. That's much better choice over the Chaintech if you're going NF4 route. I also belive that the Xpress200 chipset should've been included as alternative. It's the perfect board for budget PC and it'll allow LOTS of options for upgrades later down the road. The only downside is that the MSI's uATX board doesn't have any OC capability, but who's looking for that in a budget-minded PC?If AMD can get a Sempron out for Socket 939 for around $100... then we can have some really nice sub $400-500 PC with lots of options for upgrade.
jxtramd - Wednesday, March 16, 2005 - link
OK I've followed the budget guide now for about 6 months and I'm on the cusp of a decision about building an AMD IGP based system. The choices are either from the Jan 05 guide with the MSI (or other) MB with the nForce2 IGP or the Mar 05 Chaintech (or other) MB with the VIA K8M800 IGP. Both systems with an appropiate Sempron 2600 and 512 memory. Between the two which combo gives the better graphics performance? I'm not interested in gaming. Just a basic system with the ability to capture video and watch DVD's as examples. A IGP system fits my budget - any comments?Jep4444 - Wednesday, March 16, 2005 - link
A little look on newegg has shown that every 32-bit 6200TC has 16MB of onboard RAM, oddly enough their are NO 32MB 6200TCs on newegg at all(whether 32 or 64-bit)also i looked at the review you guys posted on the 6200TC and here's a little bit of info on the 16MB and 32MB parts
"With NVIDIA talking about bringing the new 32MB 64-bit TurboCache part out at $99 and the 16MB 32-bit part out at $79"