ASRock's High-End Vision 3D HTPC Reviewed
by Ganesh T S on October 3, 2010 10:20 AM EST
We have been using our media streamer test suite for the last few reviews in the HTPC / media streamer space. In v1.0.1 of the test suite used in the WDTV Live Plus review, we added DVD and Blu-Ray folder structures to the mix. In v1.0.2, we have added three Xvid clips (one with Q-Pel, and two others with GMC (Global Motion Compensation) using 2 and 3 warp points respectively) and a MKV stream with forced subtitles. For the Vision 3D, we used v1.0.2 of the media streamer test suite. Weights have been assigned to each of the test stream based on how frequently one might encounter each type of file in a home theater setting.
We now have 50 streams in our test suite and a maximum possible score of 350. Presenting a table listing every stream would make this section messy. Instead, moving forward, we will only indicate streams which have playback issues. In addition to that, for HTPCs, we will also indicate all the different softwares / codecs used to enable playback of all the test streams.
The Vision 3D is the first pre-built HTPC we have reviewed to score a perfect 100% in our media streamer test suite. However, this was not quite straightforward, as it was quite difficult to find the correct splitter / filter / renderer combinations for some of the test streams. The following softwares were used to process our media streamer test suite:
- Cyberlink PowerDVD 10.0.2025.52 OEM 3D
- MPC-HC x64 1.4.2499 with ffdshow Audio Decoder (x64 SVN 3572)
- VLC 1.1.4
- Monogram GraphStudio with MPC-HC Matroska Splitter (for 024-1080p24.x264.DTS-MA.7Ch.mkv, which had minor stutters with the default MPC-HC combination used to playback other streams)
- Monogram GraphStudio with Sage Mpeg Demux Splitter (for 042-1080p24.VC1.TrueHD.AC3, which the latest MPC-HC M2TS splitter couldn't split properly. VLC could play this back without bitstreaming, but GraphStudio, with the Sage splitter was able to properly deliver the TrueHD soundtrack to ffdshow for bitstreaming).
3D Playback
Vision 3D's claim to fame is the enabling of 3D Blu-Ray playback with HDMI 1.4a output. However, 3D technology equipment is pretty high-end even for us reviewers. However, that would be no excuse to not test it out, right?! Thankfully, Tom Vaughan from Cyberlink invited me over to Cyberlink's office in Fremont, CA to make use of their demo equipment (3D TV / AV receiver). With the Vision 3D in hand, I landed up over there at 8 AM one morning, and proceeded to test out 3D Blu-Ray playback with the Vision 3D using the OEM PowerDVD version supplied by ASRock. I was also quite surprised that PowerDVD was able to correctly identify stereoscopic WMV files and play them back appropriately on the 3D TV.
Tom also gave us some useful insights on 3D technology and how Cyberlink is gearing up to handle the upcoming challenges in the HTPC area, but those are details for another day and another article. We are grateful to Tom and Cyberlink for providing us with the opportunity to make use of their facilities.
Refresh Rate Handling
Many HTPC purists are concerned about the lack of support for proper display refresh rates. This was one of the main drawbacks of the Core 100 reviewed earlier. The Vision 3D, with nV's 260.66 drivers, has no such issues. This can be observed from the following screenshots. MPC-HC's statistics OSD indicates that the display correctly refreshes at 23.976 Hz with the 23 Hz setting for Vision 3D, while Core 100 indicates a refresh rate of 23.999 Hz for the 23 Hz setting.
23 Hz Setting on Core 100 / Vision 3D (Click to enlarge)
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firewall597 - Monday, October 4, 2010 - link
Thats not very fair to say "to me its only worth $---"The product was built with 3D and high end in mind, if this isnt what you need then you shouldn't buy it. Doesnt make it worth any less. There was a fairly accurate breakdown of costs early in the article that laid out how narrow their profit margins could actually be. I would assign this much more value then, say, anything from apple with a similar price tag. If you know what I mean.
If you're only going to need $599's worth of the parts, then buy a lesser box for $599.
andygallo - Monday, October 4, 2010 - link
Everyone has a different experience with drive manufacturers. For me WD has always been reliable. I still run the original 36GB Raptor that I got 5 or 6 years ago and it's still fast as hell and have no issues at all. I have a couple of other WD's that are older than that running great in my storage server. If I were to blanket generalize my experience, however, I would say Seagate and Maxtor are crap.CUDA is NOT CPU+GPU in parallel, CUDA is simply an API that allows GPU computing. The "parallel" in CUDA (Compute Unified Device Architecture) is simply referring to the fact that a GPU is a massively parallel processing unit. What that means is, for certain specific tasks (like HD video encoding/decoding or fluid dynamic models), you can just dump to the GPU for the processing since it is far and away better at running these types of tasks than a traditional CPU. The CPU pretty much does nothing if CUDA is being called.
Also CUDA is NOT supported on AMD/ATI cards, CUDA is specifically for Nvidia. Last I heard, AMD/ATI's solution was called Stream, but I dunno if that's still the case.
From my experience with HTPC builds, Nvidia is definately the way to go. HD video acceleration (DXVA/DXVA2 for Windows or VDPAU for Linux) has MUCH better support on Nvidia cards (VDPAU doesn't even support ATI cards, so if you wanna use XBMC, use a Nvidia card). I've had quite a few h.264 encoded HD videos that couldn't be accelerated on an ATI card that worked flawlessly on an Nvidia. I have yet to see the opposite (and don't get me started on Intel's X4500 "video acceleration"... what a joke). From what I understand that stems from how the video was encoded and that ATI is far less forgiving than Nvidia. Could be a driver issue, but I've seen this disparity since I started playing with h.264 and even today am still able to reproduce the issue (at least 3 years).
humba - Sunday, October 3, 2010 - link
I believe there's one bit missing from the article - a comparison to some of the competing models that could server as a HTCP. I've been using a mini with Win7 and external Blu-ray and I'm very much interested in the Vision 3D. But I'd like to know how it compares in terms of upgrading (Macs are a PITA in that department - especially the 2010 variety - and I'd much rather have a 240GB SSD than a 500GB slow noisemaker), and noise (even under significant load the device stays very quiet).Also.. since this is HDMI 1.4 - can you now drive 2560x1600 over HDMI? Dell claims their 2008 30" model does that resolution over HDMI.. and it sorta works (movies are fine... windows look messed up but I suspect the supposedly dual link capable DVI to HDMI adapter may be at fault)?
Tros - Sunday, October 3, 2010 - link
I am also interested in a comparison. Especially with that kind of price-tag.Also: Is that a newer mac-mini, or and older one? I'd understand the newer one being hard to upgrade, but the older ones not much harder (ifixit.com) than this Vision3d model.
humba - Monday, October 4, 2010 - link
I have the older mini. I agree, it's not that hard to upgrade - however, it's not something for the faint of heart.ganeshts - Sunday, October 3, 2010 - link
As we review more SFF HTPCs, we will present what you want :) We will have the Zino 410 reviewed soon.From HTPC viewpoint, a Mac Mini simply doesn't make sense even though a lot of people use it. There is no HD audio bitstreaming, no native BR drive support. I don't think we ever will reivew a Mac Mini in this space (although Anand reviews them from the general PC perspective, with a section for HTPC).
These PCs from ASRock are primarily targeted towards the DIY market (slowly moving to the layman consumer). As such, they are very easy to upgrade. The HTPC comes with a brochure outlining steps to replace anything and everything you want inside (Even the MXM card!).
Yes, HDMI 1.4a and DVI dual link port can both drive 2560x1600 according to nVidia. We didn't test it out personally, but we have no reason to doubt nV's or ASRock's claims in that department.
humba - Monday, October 4, 2010 - link
Couldn't you just have the software player decode TrueHD / DTS MA to PCM and stream that over the DP / HDMI port? And there's an aftermarket BR upgrade - again not for the faint of heart, but until not so long ago, there weren't any viable alternatives.Aikouka - Monday, October 4, 2010 - link
I didn't even realize that Dell released a new SFF PC for media purposes until I read this article, so naturally, I was curious enough to check it out. I saw the initial price of $299 and was intrigued... is a non-streaming HTPC for a decent price possible? Well, it seems Dell brought my hopes up and subsequently squashed them like a bug. The biggest problem I found with the Zino HD410 is that if you want something decent, it's going to cost you....When I customized the HD410 to an acceptable level, it cost $699. The biggest problems seem to be my need for Windows 7 Professional and the Radeon 5450. I use Windows 7 Professional, because I prefer being able to remote into my HTPCs rather than having to turn the TV on just to make a simple change. Home Premium does not allow incoming RD connections, but does allow outgoing. The issue is that Dell charges $100 to upgrade from Home Premium to Professional... the same "upgrade" on NewEgg is around $40. You also need the 5450 to support bitstreaming, but the only way to get the 5450 is through the higher-end models which start at $499. I also find the requirement of a 500GB HDD in the higher-end models fairly useless... I don't need that much space on the drives and would rather reduce the size to save money.
For that price, I'd probably just consider building a PC using Thermaltake's ElementQ case. It's about the same width (~8" vs ~8.5"), but the Thermaltake case has 5" more depth to it, which shouldn't be an issue in an entertainment center.
Aikouka - Monday, October 4, 2010 - link
Clarification, the customized price on the Dell Zino HD410 is $599, not $699. My bad!Zap - Sunday, October 3, 2010 - link
That "thick copper bar" on the MXM copper plate is a heatpipe. If it really were a "thick copper bar" then it would probably overheat before you finished booting into Windows. Heatpipes do not have to be round.