AMD’s Enduro Switchable Graphics Levels Up
by Jarred Walton on September 6, 2012 3:00 AM ESTClosing Thoughts
It’s been a long road for AMD’s switchable graphics drivers, but if AMD can deliver everything they’re promising, we’re finally seeing the light at the end of the tunnel.
There have been two major frustrations over the past couple of years for us: first, we just haven’t seen much in the way of AMD mobile GPUs for review. That’s not because the systems aren’t out there, but most of the OEMs using AMD GPUs have been hesitant at best to sample them to reviewers. That’s a problem because when hardware isn’t getting reviewed, it usually means there’s not a huge amount of public interest, which means that the hardware isn’t selling. None of us want the graphics arena to turn into a one sided affair, but NVIDIA’s Optimus initiative has really caught hold since launching and AMD hasn’t had a proper answer—until now.
The second issue with AMD’s mobile graphics solutions has been the drivers. Discrete-only notebooks have been able to get driver updates, but only at the cost of usable battery life; meanwhile the more interesting switchable solutions have received essentially nothing in the way of driver updates from the laptop OEMs—the Sony VAIO C I tested a year ago continues to have most of the same driver problems, and the last driver update from Sony in October 2011 uses 8.850 series drivers from AMD (roughly matching up with the Catalyst 11.5 release). HP’s ENVY 15t-3000 is a more recent offering with an Ivy Bridge CPU and HD 7750M graphics, and the drivers there are 8.951 (Catalyst 12.3) and haven’t been updated in months. If you purchase a laptop with a discrete GPU, presumably you want to use that GPU for gaming or other graphics applications, and that means you’ll want to get driver updates on occasion. Prior to the Enduro 5.5 update that hasn’t generally been possible, and we’re eager to see that change.
Overall, we’re pleased to see AMD taking a serious look at their switchable graphics technology and working to bring it up to the level of the competition. We wish it would have happened sooner, but at least it's not too late to get things headed in the right direction—and we'd suggest that perhaps dropping the monthly driver updates is part of the reason we're finally getting needed Enduro enhancements. Right now, it feels as if Enduro 5.5 is basically where Optimus was back in early 2010, so AMD’s not out of the woods yet, but get us a couple driver updates this year and we’ll be ready to believe that Mobility Radeon users will receive the same level of driver support as desktop Radeon users.
We’ve never really had a problem with the performance of AMD’s mobile GPUs, and in recent years they have often managed to trump NVIDIA on a bang-for-the-buck analysis. Unfortunately, without driver updates we’ve been hesitant to recommend laptops with AMD’s mobile GPUs. The 7000M “London” GPUs (basically GCN/Southern Islands for mobile users) have a lot to offer, and with the updates to Enduro and regular driver releases from AMD, the mobile graphics competition is about to get a lot more interesting. Competition is always nice to see.
For anyone interested in seeing the full set of “Enduro 5.5” slides, the above gallery is available.
Update: Many readers have commented (and there are lengthy forum posts elsewhere) on issues with the 7970M GPU being underutilized while playing games. I ran a few quick tests of my own with the preview drivers to see if things are any better. All tests were run at 1080p, with the games set to either "Medium" or "Maximum" settings. Here are the results:
| Clevo P170EM GPU Utilization | ||
| Game | 1080p ~Medium | 1080p ~Maximum |
| Batman: Arkham City | 47% | 100% |
| Diablo III | 98% | 99% |
| DiRT 3 | 62% | 100% |
| Elder Scrolls: Skyrim | 54% | 60% |
Obviously, the GPU isn't being maxed out in terms of what it can do in many of our test cases, and our complete benchmark results back this up. Especially at lower detail settings and lower resolutions, the HD 7970M isn't scaling to the sort of frame rates we'd expect. Is this a problem with Enduro in general, or just with the current drivers? AMD might also be intentionally scaling down GPU utilization (and thus performance) at lower quality settings, as the difference between 100 FPS and 150 FPS isn't particularly important on a 60 Hz LCD.
That said, in many cases we're seeing slightly lower performance with the preview drivers than the initial drivers, so clearly there's optimization work that needs to be done, and we may see improved results with the public release (most likely in October). While many people are frustrated with the current situation, I maintain that getting regular driver updates is the first hurdle that AMD needs to address; once that's in place, future driver releases can hopefully improve performance (along with GPU utilization).
Facebook
Twitter
RSS
200 Comments
View All Comments
Vozier - Thursday, September 6, 2012 - link
you DO have a point, i agree with you.Maybe this aint the best place for this, lets keep this article a source of help and not an open window to complain, just a thougt...
regards
Voz
JarredWalton - Thursday, September 6, 2012 - link
The good news is that we won't be deleting anything here, I can guarantee that. You might also consider asking NBR and the other places where threads have been deleted exactly why they did so. If a forum kowtows to the manufacturers and deletes negative posts -- especially posts that are full of data showing the problem with a specific set of hardware -- I'm not sure I'd trust the forums any longer. Actions like that are basically saying, "We want advertising money more than we want members."Vozier - Thursday, September 6, 2012 - link
DITTO.vgray35@hotmail.com - Thursday, September 6, 2012 - link
Maybe so, but there is a lot that should be said and was not said. Two issues needed to be differentiated - the fix itself, and corporate shenanigans, and the latter needed some attention. I will try to be silent now.transphasic - Sunday, September 9, 2012 - link
Excellent points! Well said.transphasic - Sunday, September 9, 2012 - link
The problem with this is, I didn't know about the Enduro mess causing low FPS rates and utilization problems until after the 30 day return policy was up.I suspect the same thing can and will be said by others as well.
Since we all had no idea initially that Enduro was causing all this when we bought our Sagers, it was only starting to snowball downhill with more and more reports coming in about this. Then I got to see it firsthand with the games that I played, and that was after the 30 day return period, so by then, I will stuck with it.
I contact Sager about it, and they told me that there was no problem with the 7970M, so there was nothing I could do about it, short of swapping out my GPU card for the Nvidia, and that, they said, would cost me $800 dollars to do.
Obviously, Sager was flat our wrong about it, and that makes things even worse for all of us.
hulawafu77 - Thursday, September 6, 2012 - link
I find it curious AnandTech's reviewer wasn't more shocked that the 580M performed better than the 7970M in over half the games. If you look at the specs AMD posted, the 7970M is about 2X more powerful than the 580M. The in game results are just incredible, I really hope AnandTech edits the article to be more outraged that a machine that costs $1,500 today performs less than a $1200 machine in half the games. The current 675M is a rebadge of the 580M and costs signifitcantly less. What if the 7970 desktop performed less than last years 580 in over half the games? But I forgot, this is mobile, and us mobile users don't matter.
On the popular NBR forum, threads are being closed and deleted because AMD has issued legal threats to some OEM/Brands who have been nice enough to try and gather feedback to help us owners. NBR was asked by said OEM, and NBR complied because said OEM, Sager, have been a great supporter of the forum and had great relations. They did this as a favor, so NBR is not to blame, nor is Sager.
A post from NBR that clarifies that it was in fact AMD that requested the threads to be closed/deleted.
http://img862.imageshack.us/img862/8637/34838071.p...
Please check Rage3D. On Rage3D we've had an advocate on our behalf and AMD continues to ignore his inquiries and it's been 2 months with no results since AMD claimed they were investigating the issue. Clearly for AMD, mobile users are second class and do not deserve the performance they paid for, even though the mobile counterpart to desktop part is nearly 2X in price. The 7970M is a $500 piece of hardware and yet we just get spit in our face.
I know on NBR, Rage3D and Guru3D, 7970M users are furious. And on this review, I get the sense, it's meh, AMD is working on it. No big deal attitude.
hulawafu77 - Thursday, September 6, 2012 - link
http://forum.notebookreview.com/sager-clevo/686991...Sure the article title and the objective of the thread is biased, but I think overtime it will clearly show that mobile gamers right now, in their opinion between the two flagship titans, Nvidia 680 at $300 more is a better value, since it works.
transphasic - Sunday, September 9, 2012 - link
You are absolutely right about this. For us sorry 7970m owners, it simply amounts to the old saying: "Penny wise, pound foolish", because since Sager said that if I wanted to swap out my 7970m for the FAR BETTER Nvidia 680m, it would cost me a total of $800.Gee, what would I rather do- spend an extra $300 now, or $800 later?
Hmmm....wait...let me think...
The choice is an easy one for everyone involved- spend the extra $300 for a far better GPU now, or spend A LOT more money later when you realize that what you just bought and supposedly "saved" $300 dollars on with an AMD, isn't what you bargained for.
Either way you look at it, spending an extra $300 to save $500 makes a lot more sense.
Seanzky - Thursday, September 6, 2012 - link
Take it from a guy who owns a Clevo P170EM with a 7970M built by Malibal. To say I am very disappointed in AMD's negligence in terms of providing support or even just a public statement or some kind of assurance for their non-functional technology, is a huge understatement. The thread we started in the AMD forums was locked because some AMD fanboys who don't own a GPU with Enduro problems (with no understanding of the issues whatsoever) started flaming us. The thread Sager started over at NBR was locked and deleted. The last time @CatalystCreator acknowledged the Enduro issues on Twitter was almost a month ago and hasn't mentioned it since. I've asked a few AMD reps on Twitter about Enduro problems that plague the 7900 series and one of them directed me somewhere else but then sent me a malicious link privately. (I have proof in my email.)But look no further than the NBR forums (NotebookReview.com) to see what my fellow 7970M owners have to say. Keep in mind that most of these guys are hardcore AMD bandwagon, fanboys. When the Enduro issues first surfaced, these guys stuck with AMD like they owed AMD something. Now read what their honest opinion is after they've seen and experienced the Enduro issues. It's not in our imagination, but we are getting brushed off while AMD sweeps this one under the rug. After all, why focus your money into fixing this problem or providing a recall when you can use that money and put it into R & D for the next generation of GPUs to rip off even more people?
I'm not here to hate on a product I paid over $600 for, obviously. If I could defend it and be proud of it, like I hoped I would, I would really much rather do that. But I can't. I'm just a very disappointed customer who put faith and money into AMD's product and in turn was left hanging high to dry.
My advice to those looking into building a high end custom laptop? Do you research. Don't go to these biased reviews sponsored by AMD. Go to the forums where real owners own the actual product. Watch out videos, logs, tests, etc. THAT'S where you can find FACTS.
(I reckon my comment will be deleted for whatever fishy reasons, but at least I tried.)