HTPC - TV Tuner Reviews
by Jarred Walton on December 7, 2005 12:05 AM EST- Posted in
- Smartphones
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Video Quality Comparison
So far, we've talked a lot about the video quality, and we've included some screenshots of the content produced by these cards. If a picture is worth a thousand words, a movie is worth a thousand images, right? Still images don't convey the true experience of using the cards, so we decided to make some video clips available for download for anyone who's interested.
I'm going to try something a bit unusual here, and rather than hosting the files on our server, I thought I'd give BitTorrent a shot. It's like distributed computing for bandwidth, right? If you've never used or heard of BitTorrent (where have you been hiding!?), the program works similar to a peer-to-peer file sharing application. The difference is that you first have to download a seed file, which tells your computer what server to connect to, along with a checksum for each piece of the file. You can then download pieces of the file in any order, and the end result is guaranteed to be correct. You also have to share what you've already downloaded with others; in other words, you have to upload.
If you want more information, here's a quick tutorial. My personal preference for BitTorrent clients is Azureus - one of the best user interfaces, and one of the few Java applications that I find to be compelling! If you're feeling generous, you can seed the torrent once you've finished the download. I'll probably take down the torrent server (which is running on my home network) in a month and update this page, but until then, the videos will be available. (E-mail me if you have problems.)
Download the Torrent
If you're not interested in seeing the video clips, there's no need to download these files. The total file size is 450 MB for the included videos and images, and I have samples of most of the recording modes. Note that the movie player used will have an impact on the quality of the output. Windows Media Player 10 (WMP10) and The Core Media Player (TCMP) both showed interlacing on the 1080i content, and this was not visible when using either FusionHDTV or MyHD software. Media Player Classic also showed 1080i without showing interlacing, although it may simply be discarding half of the frames and interpolating the missing lines. I also encountered periodic glitches playing the movies back outside the FusionHDTV and MyHD software. These glitches are not visible normally, as the bundled software apparently has better error correction.
So far, we've talked a lot about the video quality, and we've included some screenshots of the content produced by these cards. If a picture is worth a thousand words, a movie is worth a thousand images, right? Still images don't convey the true experience of using the cards, so we decided to make some video clips available for download for anyone who's interested.
I'm going to try something a bit unusual here, and rather than hosting the files on our server, I thought I'd give BitTorrent a shot. It's like distributed computing for bandwidth, right? If you've never used or heard of BitTorrent (where have you been hiding!?), the program works similar to a peer-to-peer file sharing application. The difference is that you first have to download a seed file, which tells your computer what server to connect to, along with a checksum for each piece of the file. You can then download pieces of the file in any order, and the end result is guaranteed to be correct. You also have to share what you've already downloaded with others; in other words, you have to upload.
If you want more information, here's a quick tutorial. My personal preference for BitTorrent clients is Azureus - one of the best user interfaces, and one of the few Java applications that I find to be compelling! If you're feeling generous, you can seed the torrent once you've finished the download. I'll probably take down the torrent server (which is running on my home network) in a month and update this page, but until then, the videos will be available. (E-mail me if you have problems.)
Download the Torrent
If you're not interested in seeing the video clips, there's no need to download these files. The total file size is 450 MB for the included videos and images, and I have samples of most of the recording modes. Note that the movie player used will have an impact on the quality of the output. Windows Media Player 10 (WMP10) and The Core Media Player (TCMP) both showed interlacing on the 1080i content, and this was not visible when using either FusionHDTV or MyHD software. Media Player Classic also showed 1080i without showing interlacing, although it may simply be discarding half of the frames and interpolating the missing lines. I also encountered periodic glitches playing the movies back outside the FusionHDTV and MyHD software. These glitches are not visible normally, as the bundled software apparently has better error correction.
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8steve8 - Wednesday, December 7, 2005 - link
bottom line:if i want to watch/record hdtv channels like HBO and/or discover via a PC...
im out of luck?
those channels are not ota... are provided through a cable provider....
i can do this once cable card finally comes around?
JarredWalton - Wednesday, December 7, 2005 - link
HBO and most other movie channels are encrypted. Funny enough, some of the on demand channels seem to be picked up. For instance channels 101-1, 101-2, 102-1, 102-2, and several subchannels on the physical channels 93 and 94 all showed what amounts to random content. Movies, cartoons, and yes, even porn. If you tuned in to one of the channels, sometimes you would see it going to fast-forward mode, like the person watching the content was skipping ahead.Cable card is supposed to allow you to view encrypted content on TVs as well as computers without a set-top box. Until I see it in actual use, though, I'm not exactly sure how it's going to work. I would assume it will just store an encrypted TP file, and the cable card will contain the decryption logic.
nullpointerus - Wednesday, December 7, 2005 - link
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cablecard">http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/CablecardI've been waiting for decent HTPC CableCard products for ~2 years now. They'll probably come out very late in 2006, achieve their intended interoperability sometime between the second and third generation of products, and become practically flawless around the same time that they become obsolete. That's just a guess, mind you...
Tujan - Wednesday, December 7, 2005 - link
It was intriging because nobody has really compared the use of DIY HTPCs. With what limited parts are available.I wouldn't use a non-multicore processor for something dealing with HDPCs. Just the shear amount of graphics and screen space,the relative newcomer to its display of screen space,. The notorious 'switching between apps,and those running in the background,- much less using the PCI bus to do so.
What I did miss out of this story,was a shot of a connected MYHD130 to its screen display. Kind of lost me there. With the connect ups to utilizing a screen,and the computers video card. See Im reading imagining toggling between user interface,remote,and what this means to the rigging of separate devices outside the computer itself.Caveat Emptor for/from them along side. And you mentioned that ATI was 'out-of-the-picture , for HDTV unless the components where hooked up. So to share that ATI graphics cards are not useful for the MYHD130.
Would certainly make a wish list to the MYHD130 to put it onto the PCI-e lane.Get it off the PCI bus.
As for those encrypted channels.Are you sure they would stay that way ? Think you could pick out your PPV (Pay-Per-view) channel from that list ? [ ]
You mentioned your Monitor,that they have in common Overscan.I simply have the question included to involve just how a HTPC will correctly recognize a monitor (consider a 32 to 40" LCD TV) ,when most this involves the PNP feature Ive known for doing so.? [ ]
ATI cards aren't any good with the DTV if using the DVI for/from them for the HD screens ? Think 32" to 42" LCD TVs here.[ ]
- glad your doing the experimenting here.Good article.
JarredWalton - Wednesday, December 7, 2005 - link
LCD TVs shouldn't have a problem with overscan. Any rear projection displays will have overscan, and I believe all DLP have overscan as well. There are some good DLP displays that only have 1% overscan, though -- too bad they're really expensive.If you want a picture of what the MyHD looks like when connected, let me see about uploading one and I'll provide a link. This is with the DVI daughter card:
http://images.anandtech.com/reviews/multimedia/tvt...">DVI Passthru Image
http://images.anandtech.com/reviews/multimedia/tvt...">VGA Passthru Image
Hopefully that's clear - there's a lot of cable clutter, so I labeled the pertinent connections.
Tujan - Wednesday, December 7, 2005 - link
Thanks for reply. Even though I know a lot,Im still a novice. Know a lot of the acronymns,but dealing with things marketed off the top just keeps me on to them for a limited span.The picture there,the top card is the video card,with the lower cards being the TV tuners then.Im thinkin that somehow your giving up a controlled connection to your display from the computer by using the MyHD130 ? Or it limits the 'out of your video card when you only would have a single hook up on the Display.[ ]
- I will go to there site to look for more.
Encryption ? [ ] Mean if you subscribe to HBO via your home cable line,HBO will not be able to be seen if utilizing the HTPC with the QAM/HD TV cards ?
Certainly the situation would be averted for the configuration of the cable to Display(cable box to default display) - since (T,F) the Display has an encryption chip within it to do so,(1),or (2) Encryption is handled via the cable box. With everything else dealing with something of the HDCP,HDMI type scenarios.... The encryption mechanism has got to work somewhere in the final render at the Display. Certainly the Cable Company isn't selling me the Display.....
Of course this is a whole nother anchalotta.
I pretty much just look for the configuration compatibility in the input,output for the hookups.And if the software will work/..how difficult to navigate them.
Thinking everythings hunky dory after a large investment ...Again thanks for reply.
JarredWalton - Wednesday, December 7, 2005 - link
Decryption of the encrypted channels is handled by the cable box. The cable card standard will allow other devices to do that decryption -- basically, the key/algorithm will be stored on the cable card. Of course, that means you need to have a TV and or computer that has a cable card slot. Hopefully they'll make a USB adapter.mariush - Wednesday, December 7, 2005 - link
I'm a bit dissapointed that you have used Divx to test the analog recording. XViD would have probably been much faster, at least that's how it is on my computer.Also, I would probably either use XViD set to record with quantizer 1 (max quality) which takes about 6-10 MB/s at 768x576 25fps or I would use a lossless encoder such as HuffYUV (~12 MB/s at 768x576 25fps)
JarredWalton - Wednesday, December 7, 2005 - link
The DivX codec is officially supported by the MyHD software. Xvid was far slower, and that holds in general, unless there is a special setting to get it to encode faster. All the real-time encoding has to be done through a VFW codec, and I couldn't find a fast codec to handle that. The DivX codec is also the only codec that allows you to resize the video content, at least as far as I could tell. Otherwise you end up with an incorrect aspect ratio, as seen on the top left picture on page 15.If you download the videos, you might feel that the DivX codec results in a loss of quality, even on the X2 system. That video sample is actually very close to what you see when watching live analog content with the MyHD card. At best, it's decent analog video. Just about any analog-only TV tuner will produce equal or better output.
Back to the codecs, if you really want to get a decent compression, while not losing a lot of quality, I would recommend using a second PC or re-encoding the videos while your computer is sitting idle. You could do the same thing with the TP files, re-encoding them using the Xvid codec with a data rate of around 1 GB per hour and the target, resolution of 720 x 480 -- or perhaps go for 2/3 GB per hour and target a 1280x1024 resolution.
One of the benefits of the DivX codec is that quite a few consumer-electronics devices now support it as well. I'm not aware of any DVD players that can handle Xvid.
xtknight - Wednesday, December 7, 2005 - link
Sorry for the double post, but by the way, the program AVI.NET can encode xvid and divx for standalone players. That's the whole purpose of it: to use only the features standalone players support. I recommend you try it out.