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NVIDIA GeForce GTX 295 Coming in January
NVIDIA GeForce GTX 295 Coming in January
Date: December 18th, 2008
Topic: Video Card
Manufacturer: NVIDIA
Author: Derek Wilson
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Preliminary Thoughts

With a board power of 289W, this thing isn't going to be cheap to run. Plugging two in a system is going to push the envelope, but 3-way GTX 280 will still consume more power. It is likely that NVIDIA made the changes to memory bandwidth in order to save on a couple hundred megs of RAM that would draw too much more power. Making such a move is definitely sensible, but it is at the highest end (2560x1600 with tons of blur (I mean AA, sorry)) where tons of RAM are needed to push performance.

Of course, with two cards (especially if a game is capable of alternate frame rendering (AFR)), memory limited performance issues will be mitigated quite a bit, and opening up the shader power of two GTX 280 cards in a single slot is big for games that use a lot of compute. The way future games tackle the balance of compute and memory has yet to be seen, but NVIDIA has been saying for years that the future continues to be increasing the compute ratio.

We like hard launches. This isn't one. While that's disappointing, we do really want to get our hands on this hardware. The GTX 295 definitely looks like it will best the Radeon HD 4870 X2 in terms of raw power. Beyond that, it is clear that AMD hasn't taken driver development seriously enough and CrossFire just isn't as robust as SLI. Relying on a CrossFire based solution for their highest end part means it is necessary to provide reliable performance and stability across all games, new and old, and on all platforms. Making user defined profiles that allow the forcing of different CrossFire modes on certain games would go a long way to helping, but the real relief will come when AMD decides to fix their broken driver development model.

As it stands, SLI is a better solution than CrossFire and the GPUs on the GTX 295 will really put the screws to RV770. We will very likely see NVIDIA take back the crown in terms single card performance.

That said, how sad is it that NVIDIA had to go and push this press info out there 3 weeks before availability just to try and slow AMD's momentum during the holiday season.

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69 Comments - Last by nyran125, 315 days ago
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Don't Go Bias Now :O by Xietsu, 337 days ago
"That said, how pathetic is that NVIDIA had to go and push this press info out there 3 weeks before availability just to try and slow AMD's momentum during the holiday season."

Well, it's doubtful that such a niche piece of information will affect sales that much, but I'd replace pathetic with prudent (and then add "it" after "is")! Hehe.

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RE: Don't Go Bias Now :O by jordanclock, 337 days ago
No, it is pathetic. Both companies have been doing just fine with hard launches in the past few years (I don't know if you recall the days of soft launches a month in advance of retail availability, or when an announced product never showed up at all) and for either company to take a step back with a paper launch is just stupid.

If AMD did the same thing, I'm sure they would have been called stupid too. Rightfully so, I might add.

My problem with this is that nVidia has yet to release a mid-range product in how long? The only way to get a mid-range card from nVidia is to buy the upper end of a previous generation. I would really like to see a release of sub-$200 MSRP 200-series card. That would be news worthy. Not another $500 card that even nVidia doesn't expect to sell all that well.

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RE: Don't Go Bias Now :O by Mr Perfect, 337 days ago
Yes, the lack of new cards below the 260 is disappointing. They have already renamed 8000 series parts to make the 9000 series parts, and there where reports of the 9000 series parts being renamed as GT 100 parts. Hopefully it was just a rumor.

You know there is at least one poor sap out there who's going to replace his 8800GT with a 9800GT, and then upgrade again to a GTS 150. The last time you could make a whole chain of "upgrades" and get essentially the same thing was what? The GeForce 2MX/4MX/4000 string?

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RE: Don't Go Bias Now :O by mczak, 337 days ago
A GeForce 4 MX is in no way a renamed 2 MX. While true it doesn't have the feature set of "real" GeForce 4 it is indeed a very different chip than 2 MX (with faster performance).

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RE: Don't Go Bias Now :O by StevoLincolnite, 337 days ago
The Geforce 4 MX was basically a Geforce 2 on Steroids, with it's enhanced memory controller and advanced (For back then) bandwidth saving technology's.

Dual-monitor support, and a multi-sampling anti-aliasing unit from the Ti series; the improved 128-bit DDR memory controller which was crucial to solving the bandwidth limitations that appeared on the GeForce 2 chips.

It allowed gamers to play games on the Geforce 4 MX that was originally almost un-playable on a Geforce 2.

It was also eventually released with PCI-E support and a wider memory bus, funny thing was how the card out-performed the Geforce FX5200 despite having an inferior feature set.

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RE: Don't Go Bias Now :O by larson0699, 336 days ago
P.I. and way overborrowed from http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/GeForce_4_Series

In architecture, the 4MX was an original design, not a rebrand as in 8800/9800. For need of a reasonable depiction of its features, however, it *is* most closely related to the 2Ti and performs almost proportionally better (which would lead some to think of it as a derivative).

The refresh in 2004 put this GPU on a PCI-E card with a bridge chip in between, which I wouldn't call "PCI-E support". It's a damn smart move economically when you're trying to sell the rest of your chips during a transition to a new platform, but I know not a single being who ever splurged on such a mediocre design (at least not the PCX series -- I've got a fried 6600 AGP in my hands from someone who didn't know the wiser).

And I don't know where you're getting your data, but the FX5200 dusted the MX440 by about 2:1 in most of everything. I had a Radeon 8500 once and was playing on a LAN alongside a buddy with a Radeon 7500, and his card outperformed mine because it wasn't rendering everything mine was. But when I disabled the difference in effects, my card was well ahead. When I hear of an inferior new GPU, I think GMA 3100 < GMA 950, not this.

Besides, GP's point wasn't about the GF4 but rather the twisted path of "upgrades" we're seeing more and more.

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RE: Don't Go Bias Now :O by RagingDragon, 335 days ago
How about Geforce 7600 -> 8600 -> 9500?

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RE: Don't Go Bias Now :O by SiliconDoc, 336 days ago
I'm just thrilled by the 3 week early release. I've been attacked relentlessly by red fanboys for merely telling the truth then providing the link.
So the madder they are about a week early announcement, the happier I am. But that's not the only reason. Despite the redfans screaming unfair, and crying their base is going down unfairly by "marginalized" xmas purchases..LOL... I'd be one ticked off hombre' if NVidia kept their claptrap shut and on Jan. 8th announced their new 4870x2 killer - and of course if the whiners were honest about anything at all, they'ed say so as well. That ONE consideration outwieghs ANYTHING ELSE THEY WHINE ABOUT, PERIOD.
So, I have to say there are so many I consider complete raving loons because they are so far off the mark they don't have even their own personal pocketbook in mind - which of course is akin to self immolation. Yes, they are fired up. Burning, burning down the house. They just forgot to step outside first, and remember, that my golly, that is their house they might be upgrading.
So, I certainly HOPE that ATI releases a gigantic secret cheap upgrade card on Jan. 8th, after all the red fanboys splurged their xmas cookie monies on something that DIDN'T have a " early announced release that is "harmful" to the end user".
YES, WHAT A CROCK.

Reply
RE: Don't Go Bias Now :O by DerekWilson, 337 days ago
while it may not affect volume sales, it absolutely will impact those looking to buy at the high end ... read: it will impact those looking to spend the most money on the part that provides the highest profit margin.

i'm a big believer in looking at the landscape right now and making decisions based on current reality. we can't know what the future will bring. sometimes this means i'll err on the cautious side and miss out on a deal. and sometimes people willing to sacrifice time for the possibility of a deal will be rewarded.

it could be that those who wait for the GTX 295 are making a good decision. it could be that the only thing they end up doing is wasting a month they could have spent enjoying their 4870 X2 or something. we won't really know until January.

it certainly is prudent from a marketing perspective. but we aren't interested in marketing, we are interested in the consumer and our readers. hard launches are good for those buying the cards because they know they can get their hands on what is being talked about. this kind of thing is good for NVIDIA because it stirs up interest and anticipation and people will have expectations.

but as another commenter pointed out, it is entirely possible that nvidia, like they have done in the past, could decide to not actually release any product called a GTX 295 ever or anything remotely similar to this part we are reporting on. that is the major danger of something that is not a hard launch. it has happened before and it does negatively impact consumers, the competition, and ultimately the company that did it in the first place (though this impact takes longer to materialize).

ati isn't innocent either ... they've done the same thing in the past. and we absolutely are not being biased here -- if amd were to do the same thing we would react the same way: grateful for the information but warning against the dangers of releasing this info to press before availability for the sake of our readers.




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RE: Don't Go Bias Now :O by chizow, 337 days ago
Wow Derek, hypocrite much? I don't remember reading similar protest when AMD paper-launched the 4870X2. The difference is you actually had hard numbers accompanying text in that print space! Did Nvidia not send you an ES this time around? Didn't feel as special being one of only 10 in the world like with the 4870X2 paper launch so you felt it wasn't worth putting up preview numbers? How quickly we forget.....


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