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  • syxbit - Thursday, June 26, 2014 - link

    Can you post a picture of the About screen (Baseband, kernel), and find out if the filesystem is still ext4 (or the rumoured F2FS).
  • JoshHo - Thursday, June 26, 2014 - link

    I'll check FS when I get back to the Nexus 5 but the about screen is in the gallery. Reply
  • Gamingphreek - Thursday, June 26, 2014 - link

    Just checked - relevant partitions are all EXT4 with /firmware being VFAT. Reply
  • JoshHo - Thursday, June 26, 2014 - link

    Thanks, I just checked as well and can confirm this. Reply
  • craighamilton - Saturday, December 06, 2014 - link

    The Android L is nothing like the other android phones on the market (I'd recommend seeing a
    ranking like instead).
  • Krysto - Friday, June 27, 2014 - link

    It's probably the 3.10 LTS kernel. And I almost forgot about F2FS. It would be amazing if L supported it by default, and I see no reason why it wouldn't. Reply
  • Mil0 - Friday, June 27, 2014 - link

    Switching filesystems after installation has always been a tricky thing, esp in a mobile device where you don't have a free space quarantee or can reasonably assume that power won't drop out during conversion (or user interruption - mosts users won't feel like waiting a long time). That said I could image them shipping it on new phones and perhaps giving powerusers a route to use it, perhaps with a full backup/restore. Reply
  • TheTurboFool - Friday, June 27, 2014 - link

    Kernel is 3.40-g370231c. Reply
  • tuxRoller - Friday, June 27, 2014 - link

    Er, that kernel can't exist. Maybe 3.4-g370231c? Reply
  • deltatux - Sunday, July 06, 2014 - link

    Cut him some slack, he missed a decimal. It's 3.4.0, only way that'll change is if Qualcomm changes their source branch to a newer kernel branch. NVIDIA is already on the 3.15 branch for their Tegra K1 chips. Reply
  • deltatux - Sunday, July 06, 2014 - link

    F2FS is still considered experimental. Wouldn't see it be the default Android FS for another year or 2. Filesystem development takes a lot of time and effort, if you don't mind it being experimental and can handle the occasional bugs then you can always flash F2FS capable ROMs and format the partitions as such yourself :). Reply
  • UltraWide - Thursday, June 26, 2014 - link

    What about the granular security options Google talked about? Reply
  • JoshHo - Thursday, June 26, 2014 - link

    I currently don't see this, going into maps works the same way it always has without any notification or popup. It may be coming in a future release? Reply
  • tuxRoller - Thursday, June 26, 2014 - link

    Aside from frame consistency have you noticed any decrease on touch latency that was mentioned (on the order of a few frames, so 16-48ms faster, or even 32-96ms if they were talking about the 30fps they used to use)? For me, the touch lag has been the biggest differentiator between the two platforms (Windows latency seems roughly the same as android to me). Reply
  • lilmoe - Thursday, June 26, 2014 - link

    I'd like to hear about that too. Touch lag drives me nuts, and I have no idea why this issue hasn't been addressed since Jelly Bean. Reply
  • tuxRoller - Friday, June 27, 2014 - link

    Good question. I've wondered the same thing. My guess is that the problem is multiply. One, and the biggest, drivers. Google COULD do something about this by mandating drivers meet certain criteria (the best solution for all is for all driver work to happen in the Linus tree, upstream). Two, Google should move to the fully preemptible Linux kernel. There was a great presentation by a RH engineer regarding the preempt kernel (the one Google is based on, not the rt kernel i'm speaking about) and its odd behaviors. The big takeaway is that it had, in cases of high load, a far higher jitter than even the cooperative kernel that is the default, let alone the rt branch. Three, and this may no longer be true, they need to optimize their drawing/dispatch libraries and actual rendering code. They've made massive cleanups starting with honeycomb, but there may be more left.
    Regardless of the cause, I wish the reviewers would talk more about this issue as it relates to the audio issue as well. We'll see if Josh has any thoughts, hopefully.
  • ivanc - Friday, June 27, 2014 - link

    Do you still have the link to the presentation? Reply
  • tuxRoller - Friday, June 27, 2014 - link

    LCA14: LCA14-506: Comparative analysis of preempt…:

    I believe this was it. Also, it was a linaro engineer, not rh.
  • tipoo - Friday, June 27, 2014 - link

    The HTC One M8, the Note 3, and I think the GS5 have all posted lower touchscreen response times than the iPhone 5S. That debate is down to the hardware/driver level now, Android has gotten out of the way. Reply
  • tuxRoller - Friday, June 27, 2014 - link

    Those are from that French site, correct? I'm not sure about their methodology b/c those devices also have noticeably higher latency than iOS devices.
    The qualitative test is easy to perform by looking at the lag between finger and content just after beginning movement. The key is not to move so fast that you can't see the lag. Those reviewers that manically move their finger on a screen to show how android is responsive are showing something makes it difficult to see the issue.
  • tipoo - Friday, June 27, 2014 - link

    I have a first gen iPad Mini and a Moto G in front of me and I still can't find a huge difference, using your methodology. I can notice content trail behind my finger a bit, but that's on both, not just the Android. Reply
  • tuxRoller - Sunday, June 29, 2014 - link

    Whether or not the difference is huge is entirely subjective, so you're probably right.
    For me, that initial jerk off the finger is the biggest telltale between the two platforms. To really notice it you need to just find the property jerk rate. Not so fast that you can't discern things clearly but not so slow that the positions between device pollings are so small that the differences are obscured.
    I was also wrong about reviewers methodology, somewhat. You actually can also see the difference pretty keenly by playing the air hockey game on both devices. Moving your finger around on android makes one think the "paddle" is attached to your finger with a particularly springy rubber band while on iOS the paddle stays much closer to the finger, more like a string (not exactly like they, but it follows the finger far more closely).
  • MonkeyPaw - Thursday, June 26, 2014 - link

    One feature they added is something I've wanted for a long time. Basically, if you are on a trusted WiFi network, you can bypass the Passcode. What I was wanting was to allow my devices to be easy to unlock at home, but as soon as I leave my WiFi network, a Passcode is required. I hope MS and Apple bring this option in as well (with the ability to disable it, of course). Reply
  • texasti89 - Friday, June 27, 2014 - link

    I don't think this is a good approach to securely lock/unlock mobile device, at least for me. Anyone who gets access to a person's place or wireless could easily access his/her device. It's likely that Apple's engineers have already thought of this one, but they never see the potential there.The right approach IMO is to focus on using human distinctive biological data such as fingerprint. Current fingerprint scanning technology is still not smart and accurate enough and much improvement can be done i think. Reply
  • dyc4ha - Friday, June 27, 2014 - link

    But once bio-metric passwords are compromised, it can't be reset. Something to consider Reply
  • texasti89 - Friday, June 27, 2014 - link

    Well, there is always this "man make it man break it" argument, but some techniques can always be more effective than others. I'm just disappointed that fingerprint scanners are not as ubiquitous as it should be by now. Thanks to Apple for bringing this to mobile device, now all industry will follow suit. Since the week I got my t440s laptop which has a great bio-metric scanner, I have never entered a password on that machine, thanks to the wonderful work by Lenovo, LastPass and all other companies. Now we need this on mobile devices. I think it's the next natural evolution and I hope they get it right soon. Reply
  • tuxRoller - Friday, June 27, 2014 - link

    Two factor is very effective, but I think you are more concerned with ease of use. To that end you might want to take a look at the blood flow sensors. They've been around for a few years, and apparently work really well. Reply
  • MonkeyPaw - Friday, June 27, 2014 - link

    I know it's not an ideal security feature, but it's a far more convenient one. You see, when I'm at home, it's pretty unlikely that a random person that I don't trust is going to enter my home and snoop through or steal my smartphone. However, once I leave my home and take my phone with me, the potential for loss and/or snooping is considerably greater.

    Also consider that a burglar is not likely to snoop your devices from your home, but rather grab and go. In practice, this system would lock your devices as soon as they leave the network, and even if they unplug and steal your router. If this is properly implemented, one the device leaves your trusted WiFi network, you should need to passcode unlock your device the first time you reconnect. It's not perfect security (then again, neither is current biometric solutions), but it drastically reduces the chances of foul play. If nothing else, the system buys you time to change passwords and remotely wipe the device.
  • Impulses - Friday, June 27, 2014 - link

    Besides, no one's forcing you to use this option... But it might get more people to use a secure lock. Reply
  • Chloiber - Friday, June 27, 2014 - link

    Really? This sounds awesome :) Reply
  • ryanmt - Friday, June 27, 2014 - link

    Are things working well enough to use as a daily driver? Phone calls, internet, most mainstream apps? Reply
  • Pork@III - Friday, June 27, 2014 - link

    Are you kidding with me :D
    Fucking flat comic panels that fucking designers are trying to impose in the age of 3D and holography. When all the results achieved so far in hardware performance, it is relevant to users, to say the least serious.
  • BoneAT - Friday, June 27, 2014 - link

    How on Earth we're still not getting transparent Android bars in stock Google apps (or everywhere by system default)? First off, in settings and other menus the status bar should be hidden, but we don't really need that bar too often, it should be simply accessed by pull-down similarly how Google Search works. TouchWiz hides it intelligently and it makes better screen real-estate.

    Also, I hate the black Android bar and buttons taking half an inch off the screen, at least make it transparent with some background shadow, Google made this available long ago, yet their important apps don't support it. See this app using maps with with transparent bars, just makes more sense:

    These bars have to go, come up with something intelligent, like a little up-swype from bottom functioning as a tap at the areas where home, back and multitasking used to be, or something more practical, just do something. Make the status bar only visible on home screen and lock screen by default, and transparent at all times. Add multi-screen for crying out loud!

    I'm a little disappointed how Google cares more about little design tweaks over practical things.
  • darkich - Friday, June 27, 2014 - link

    Coudn't agree more.
    Oh well, let's hope the next major touchwiz version finally connects the best of both worlds
  • jimv1983 - Friday, June 27, 2014 - link

    I always want to see the status bar at the top.

    As far as the status bar and navigation buttons having a black background instead of transparent I actually prefer the black because it makes things easier to see. The contract of the which icons on the black background is easier on the eyes. Imagine the screenshot you posted with a white background. You wouldn't even be able to see the icons at all.
  • nathanddrews - Friday, June 27, 2014 - link

    Black text on white? I thought we were past this as a species! Can it be changed in the settings? Reply
  • jwcalla - Friday, June 27, 2014 - link

    Agreed completely. So much white -- and on a phone of all things -- is just horrific. Especially with those thin black fonts.

    Do these designers even use their products?
  • Alexey291 - Sunday, June 29, 2014 - link

    Its going to be great for amoled screens as well /s

    Seriously the colour choices are awful in L. In fact the whole "design language" is effin' dire.
  • phoenix_rizzen - Monday, June 30, 2014 - link

    I agree. This colour scheme will also make it horrible to use at night ... unless you want your normal screens to function as a flashlight. And for those of us with blue eyes, white screens are actually painful at night.

    So long as the custom ROMs continue to provide the "dark UI" features, I'm okay with the default theme being bright.

    What's really annoying is the "floating" notifications. Why doesn't the notification panel cover the entire width of the screen? Why are there gaps between the notifications? Why can you see the background through the notifications and gaps? If it's a panel, it should cover the entirety of the screen (as befits the definition of a "panel"). Not be a chain of semi-transparent, separated bubbles.
  • R. Hunt - Wednesday, July 02, 2014 - link

    Look at the bright side. Next time they want to make it look "new" again, they'll have to change it back to black. For me, some of the changes are a bit "wait and see" such as the new multitasking, other are "change for the sake of change" such as settings going to white or the new, ugly, navigation buttons, and other are simply atrocious, such as the flip switch in the settings confusingly looking like a slider now.

    Looking forward to the new improvements under the hood but not convinced about the whole redesign thing. I'm a bit tired of how software companies make mountains of changes letting ego-tripped designers run wild simply to make it look "fresh" and get headlines rather than refinements to improve consistency and usability.
  • jaydee - Friday, June 27, 2014 - link

    So is this going to be 4.5, or 5.0, or are they redoing the naming scheme? Reply
  • darkich - Friday, June 27, 2014 - link

    I would really prefer if the latter is the case.
    Android L, M, N,... the update versions could just be named Android La, Lb, etc.

    It would be a very refreshing differentiator among the sea of numeric competition, imo
  • Drumsticks - Friday, June 27, 2014 - link

    I could see this getting complicated. Android L,M,N etc would be ok (although it might be hard to know what's "new" even though it's just an alphabet progression - why not start with A?) But with like a X.Y.Z release, Android Lac could get a little frustrating to say. Reply
  • Death666Angel - Friday, June 27, 2014 - link

    They started with B as the first release (A was probably their alpha) . In case you haven't noticed, all Android updates are alphabetical and the names they get are deserts with the same first character as the current Android release. Cupcake, Donut, Eclair, Froyo, Gingerbread, Honeycomb, Ice Cream Sandwich, Jelly Bean, Kit Kat. C-D-E-F-G-H-I-J-K and now L. Reply
  • Drumsticks - Friday, June 27, 2014 - link

    Oh interesting. I knew they were based on desserts but I never bothered to think about the progression of it. I'm totally ok with Android L (its actually kinda cool) I just think that the secondary letters would get confusing if they did something like Android L.a.d. Or something.

    A single letter is fine, and even in line with their current scheme, as you just pointed out. I just meant that multiple letters gets a bit weird. And people tend to quote android 4.4 kit Kat, which I think sounds cooler than android L.c :P
  • darkich - Monday, June 30, 2014 - link

    Can't believe that you missed the Android alphabet naming progression.

    Now about the possible issue that you bring up, of course, Google could also instead opt for the alphabet+numeric scheme. Letters for the main version and numbers for the sub version.
    So Android L, L1,L2,L3.. and then the Android M.

    That would actually be the most proper way imo
  • darkich - Friday, June 27, 2014 - link

    Android now needs a desktop UI mode to shift into when connected to monitor screen.

    And.. A freaking ON SCREEN CLOCK already!
  • jimv1983 - Friday, June 27, 2014 - link

    There has always been an on screen clock. Reply
  • darkich - Saturday, June 28, 2014 - link

    I meant on screen clock when the screen is off of course.
    Like on future phones and every other mobile platform besides Android and iOS
  • darkich - Saturday, June 28, 2014 - link

    *feature phones Reply
  • Spunjji - Monday, June 30, 2014 - link

    You mean like this:

    Or like the Moto X has. I'm sure it's not the only Android phone with that feature, just the most recent.
  • Impulses - Friday, June 27, 2014 - link

    "The new multitasking UI is also surprisingly usable. In this regard I think the information density has been increased, as it’s theoretically possible to show up to four application tiles at one time instead of the three that used to be shown."

    Huh? Is that in addition to the app you were in or what? When I press the app switcher button on my Nexus 5 I see four app thumbnails, well, three and most of a fourth (4/5ths of it?). I also find it easier to tap thru in a hurry than that pseudo 3D tab switcher from Chrome, which this new app switcher imitates (I think). Not a big deal either way, it's just kinda odd they're going to a more graphic intensive switcher (while Sense has gone the opposite way).
  • phoenix_rizzen - Monday, June 30, 2014 - link

    Depends on your DPI settings. ;)

    With a DPI of 400 on an LG G2 (the N5's big brother) the Recents panel shows 4 full screens, and a smidge of a 5th.

    However, the big difference between the old and the new Recents is how much of the app screen is shown. The old Recents shows the app's full screen; the new Recents only shows the top half or so of the app's screen.

    So, you go from 4 full screens to 1 half screen + 2 smaller screens. Yeah, that's an improvement. :roll-eyes:
  • jimv1983 - Friday, June 27, 2014 - link

    I don't like the removal of lock screen widgets, the removal of battery status in quick settings or the white color that replaces the old gray in the settings. Reply
  • jimv1983 - Friday, June 27, 2014 - link

    What is up with the new keyboard? There is not indication of where one key ends and the next begins. No separation between them. Reply
  • reggjoo1 - Friday, June 27, 2014 - link

    Will it have a low footprint, like kitkat? I wonder if it will be installed on mid range, to budget devices. Reply
  • coburn_c - Friday, June 27, 2014 - link

    Wow those new buttons are ugly. Actually the whole thing is kind of ugly. Reply
  • AEdouard - Saturday, June 28, 2014 - link

    I wish they would drop the blue color in menus. Just go all white. Cleaner. Reply
  • martixy - Sunday, June 29, 2014 - link

    I've been on ART since 4.4.2 or something and initial startup and then migration to 4.4.3 and 4.4.4 took FOREEEEVER. So yea, it's definitely noticeable.
    And I have yet to discover any issues, including in apps that require root.

    The most relevant issue however is of course: Are we getting Android Licorice or something else?
  • dwade123 - Monday, June 30, 2014 - link

    Still so ugly doe. Reply
  • etre - Monday, June 30, 2014 - link

    4.3 is the end of the road for me. Is the last version which can run the original aosp browser.

    I rooted, deleted apps, greenify-ed apps, disabled syncs, installed custom kernels on my S4 and still I am getting system notifications that an update is available.

    I would like to have complete control over my device. Having "clear all" removed in drop down notification list is not a step in the correct direction. I am annoyed as it is. After I clear all the SMSs will keep coming back until I open them.

    I sense that soon we will get advertising in our notification bar ... just wait an see.

    As said, maybe is a good time to explore other options.
  • phoenix_rizzen - Monday, June 30, 2014 - link

    Custom 4.4.4 ROMs include the AOSP browser. It's one of the first apps I "hide" and "freeze" after installing a new ROM (Mahdi, Slim for sure). Reply
  • eio - Monday, July 07, 2014 - link

    Storage performance (AndroBench) seems to be massively improved under Android can that be true? Reply

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