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  • milomnderbnder21 - Sunday, May 22, 2005 - link

    http://xbox360.ign.com/articles/617/617951p1.html

    There's a link, as proof I guess...
    Reply
  • milomnderbnder21 - Sunday, May 22, 2005 - link

    That critique/comparison is actually straight from Microsoft, some department or something. It was posted recently on IGN360, they said it was emailed to them or something from Microsoft.

    Obviously, that makes it biased, but there's no denying that it brings up a couple of interesting points. I would expect the PS3 to be more powerful though. The article underestimates the Cell.
    Reply
  • Anand Lal Shimpi - Sunday, May 22, 2005 - link

    golemite

    It was real, not running at full speed, but the only working 360 shown to the public at E3.

    Take care,
    Anand
    Reply
  • golemite - Saturday, May 21, 2005 - link

    so was the 360 at the ATI booth an actual prototype or not? from what i was told, it was one of the first working test units. Reply
  • Anand Lal Shimpi - Saturday, May 21, 2005 - link

    flatblastard

    I don't get the impression that Nintendo will be able to compete, specification-wise, with Microsoft and Sony. That doesn't mean that their console won't be competitive because, after all, it is the games that matter. But without strongly competitive specs, it wouldn't make sense for Nintendo to reveal anything at E3 from a PR standpoint.

    barnett25

    I'm not one to critique other peoples' work, but there are a number of factual errors presented in that link.

    Remember that the Xbox 360's 256GB/s of bandwidth is a figure for on-die bandwidth between the 192 FPUs and the embedded DRAM on the daughter die. Including that figure in a system bandwidth comparison is like me telling you how much bandwidth exists between the Pentium 4's Trace Cache and its Decoder and then comparing that to the Athlon 64's main memory bandwidth. It's not a valid comparison.

    Comparing the number of general purpose cores between the two CPUs (cell and xbox 360) and using that as a benchmark is also a highly invalid comparison. If I published an article where I said that the dual core Pentium D 840 offered twice the general purpose performance as a single core Athlon 64 4000+...well, you guys wouldn't buy that would you :) So why would that sort of a comparison work for the PS3 vs. Xbox 360?

    I wouldn't put much faith in those types of claims, if you go back and read any of our articles about CPU architecture (including the Cell article) you will realize that a number of these types of claims are quite easily debunked.

    As I mentioned before, I'm not one to criticize other peoples' work, but if you have any specific questions about whether or not a particular claim is true (or makes sense) ask it and I'll do my best to answer it.

    Take care,
    Anand
    Reply
  • Staples - Saturday, May 21, 2005 - link

    Very neat. Seems like the PS3 is almost a faster PS2 and that is about all. MS certainly has the upperhand as far as interface goes. Reply
  • barnett25 - Friday, May 20, 2005 - link

    Anand: I'd like to see what you have to say about the PS3, Xbox comparison at http://www.majornelson.com. Reply
  • flatblastard - Friday, May 20, 2005 - link

    Anand #19

    I do appreciate your effort in at least making an attempt to get into the press conference. How did it go...."Fink? We've never heard of you." I guess the old saying that, It's Not What You Know, It's Who You Know, is still true. The big N has a history of doing this, so I'm not really surprised. I guess I was just expecting more from our great reviewer but if there was nothing to report, then there's nothing to report. duh
    Reply
  • tfranzese - Friday, May 20, 2005 - link

    #24, sorry if you don't like me actually looking forward to the big N's next console. I actually enjoy my Gamecube along side my Xbox, so I will probably be buying two consoles again.

    As long as Nintendo makes their 1st party titles, that's enough reason for me to buy their system. I don't buy it so I can play EA's 20th rendition of Madden, Live, NFS, or any other 3rd party title. I'll have an Xbox for that junk. I've been more than satisfied with the quality and quantity of titles Nintendo has put on the Gamecube, and I have more to look forward to.
    Reply
  • shaw - Friday, May 20, 2005 - link

    #20 Look at how much nostalgia helps Sega. :p

    People used to think the world was flat once, get over it, move on.
    Reply
  • shaw - Friday, May 20, 2005 - link

    The first Killzone was a generic FPS. So I guess the sequal will be generic FPS part 2. I have about as much faith in Guerella as I do in Digital Extremes for making a good FPS. Reply
  • Generic Guy - Friday, May 20, 2005 - link

    So, the initial tone of the article is "disappointed." Why on earth should you be disappointed about lack of information about two vapor consoles whose hardware hasn't even been finalized yet, and isn't due out until the end of year at earliestl And machines whose makers are both engaged in ridiculous schlong-swinging hype ("our machine is 4873 times better than last years model..."). Who expected more than empty display shells, a la "Phantom". Who really expected anything other than hype and spin doctoring from either Microsoft or Sony? I mean, C'mon! What did you really expect?

    The really amazing thing I thought was the reserved, sober, and relatively honest pronouncements coming from the former king of hype: Nintendo.
    Reply
  • ascian5 - Friday, May 20, 2005 - link

    "If you have any Windows XP machines on the same network that the 360 is connected to, the machine will automatically search for any and all shared music, pictures and videos and make them accessible from the media panel of the Xbox 360 dashboard."

    What happens with your porn? You don't want your buddies or your girl coming over and having the Xbox automatically find that stuff. Not to mention if you have kids! Hahaha
    Reply
  • tfranzese - Friday, May 20, 2005 - link

    I'm more interested in the Revolution than the other two consoles. I love my Xbox, but my Gamecube is my baby too and I look forward to what Nintendo will do with their next console. I have too much nostalgia for Nintendo to not just care. Reply
  • Anand Lal Shimpi - Friday, May 20, 2005 - link

    flatblastard

    Trust me, I tried getting reliable technical info on Revolution - it's simply not out there.

    I tried getting into the press conference; what was I told? "No new technical information will be presented."

    Revolution will be interesting, I'm sure, but the information is simply not out there right now.

    Take care,
    Anand
    Reply
  • dripgoss - Friday, May 20, 2005 - link

    #16 Screw the Revolution. There I said it. From what little info I've seen about it, I could care less. They had better release something spectacular in order to grab my money this go around. Nintendo is dying a slow painful death and I hope they hang on just long enough to keep the spirit of competition alive during this next gen. Even then, they have proven themselves as a non-competitor in the current gen console market (note I said console - not handheld) by consistently selling the GC at $50 to $100 less than the other consoles just to stay alive. They just don't understand the changing US market enough to be competitive unlike Sony and MS... Reply
  • barnett25 - Friday, May 20, 2005 - link

    No one has found out anything substantial about the Revolution. Nintendo isn't going to let us know the important stuff until MS and Sony's hardware is finalized, they've come right out and said so. Reply
  • flatblastard - Friday, May 20, 2005 - link

    That's right Anand, just keep pretending that Nintendo doesn't exist anymore.....it really shows how much you care about consoles. How is it others have found a plethora of info about Rev, but Anand finds nothing? Either didn't look hard enough or plain just don't care. Reply
  • muffin - Friday, May 20, 2005 - link

    Anyone else thinking the backgrounds on the first 2 'Marketplace' pictures look like tits from a distance? Or is that just me... Reply
  • barnett25 - Friday, May 20, 2005 - link

    Xbox Live is the one thing that is hanging me up about the Xbox360. I am a PC gamer, I'm used to playing online for free. The thought of having to pay for that is foreign to me. Then add the marketplace, which may have some reasonable items for sale. But I can easily see MS charging for things that you get for free on a PC (like game demos, freeware type games, etc). I guess I'll have to wait and see what kind of online setup the PS3 has. Reply
  • fishbits - Friday, May 20, 2005 - link

    "Honestly we aren't nearly excited as Microsoft is about the new Live Marketplace, simply because the name implies that we'll be paying for quite a bit that finds its way in there."

    I don't get where this is coming from. I'm able to buy from brick and mortar stores or online, and this is a good thing. I'm able to shop and buy 360 stuff on Live (or choose not to buy) and that's a bad thing? Looks like an actual workable micro-payment system to me, something that's been much in desire.

    Really, I'd much rather have devs/content providers busting their humps to provide games and goodies that are worth cash, especially in the pennies to few dollars range. If the item sucks, people won't buy it. If it's good, the creator gets rewarded, encouraging the creation of more quality low-priced goodies for us to enjoy.

    Of course software companies could try and sell gimped games in retail, where you need to buy additional stuff off of Live to really enjoy it. I think that would be a recipe for their demise though.
    Reply
  • slashbinslashbash - Friday, May 20, 2005 - link

    Anand,

    Thank you for this coverage. It's amazing to me that there are numerous "gaming" websites out there, none of which tell me what I want to know (things like: how the hard drive is removed; what the sides of the unit look like; multiple views of the controller so I can see how the top buttons are placed). Gaming websites basically provide me with press releases. You, on the other hand, cut straight to what I consider to be the important stuff.

    It's funny. If you'd have asked me two years ago (you might have even done so in a forum poll or something) whether Anandtech should go into covering video game console hardware, I would have replied to the negative -- that that was taken care of, there are too many gaming sites already, etc. I would have thought that it would be outside your core competency. It was the same way with digital cameras. I thought that Steve's Digicams was good enough. Boy, was I ever wrong!

    You are doing a great service to the world by providing the truth and having unbiased, straightforward reviews. Thank you.
    Reply
  • Tefl0n - Friday, May 20, 2005 - link

    Looking more and more like Sega had some influence on that controller(think Dreamcast). which isnt a bad thing. Reply
  • TheSnowman - Friday, May 20, 2005 - link

    Yeah the Killzone demo is all real time just like the geforce3 can render Final Fantasy: The Spirits Within in real time and just like The Getway looked every bit as good as the footage from the PS2 unvailing. Seriously, if you want to enough you can belive anything; but it doesn't make it anything more than BS hype. Reply
  • Reflex - Friday, May 20, 2005 - link

    #8 - If those formats are supported currently, then yes. I don't think they are however...

    #3 - The Killzone 2 demo was not in game, that has been confirmed with the developers who stated that it was made 'to the PS3 spec' in the sense that thats what people can expect them to be shooting for. It could not have been done on the PS3, they started working on that in November, but PS3 test kits only came out two months ago and still do not have everything needed to make a demo like that.

    #1 - The controllers recharge when plugged into the USB ports. So you don't have to worry about battery expenses.
    Reply
  • her34 - Friday, May 20, 2005 - link

    "If you have a Media Center Edition PC, the Xbox 360 will also act as a Media Center Extender, streaming any SD or HD content from your MCE machine."

    the video file on the pc can be any format? it can be xvid or h264?

    how exactly does that work? does it get re-encoded on the fly? or does it just stream the file and the codec gets installed on the xbox360?
    Reply
  • Jeff7181 - Friday, May 20, 2005 - link

    Awesome... AA batteries... I was afraid that was an "assembled by Microsoft" battery pack that costs $69.95 and won't hold a charge after a year. Reply
  • dripgoss - Friday, May 20, 2005 - link

    I'm stoked for one. The live integration and media possibilities looks cool. Progressive and HD native along with small wireless controller is a definite plus. I'll be buying one... Reply
  • GhandiInstinct - Friday, May 20, 2005 - link

    Why is E3 sucking so bad this year? Nothing new, and the worst is that games that are supposed to be presented aren't even there, i.e: Stalker.

    What happened? BOO!
    Reply
  • Cygni - Friday, May 20, 2005 - link

    The controllers are rechargeable... you wont be swapping out batteries like its a wavebird or anything.

    They are also RF and not IR. Im not going to complain. A solid RF controller (like the Wavebird) is hard to beat, especially if its still light, like was mentioned. I wonder if the rumble actuator was taken out of the controllers? Hard to imagine a wireless controller being lighter than an S.
    Reply
  • Shinei - Friday, May 20, 2005 - link

    I think it's pretty well confirmed by now that KillZone 2 is not pre-rendered; it's a demo recorded from actual gameplay and played back at the E3 Sony conference. It's been shown that IGN isn't the most reliable source of "inside" information, so please don't counter with an IGN links.
    And from what I've heard from KillZone 1 players, the KZ2 demo looks to have fixed most of the problems from KZ1. Of course, these same people also play KillZone for the shooting, and not the sweeping storyline, so mileage may, of course, vary.
    Reply
  • knitecrow - Friday, May 20, 2005 - link

    killzone 2??

    did you play the original?

    Ok, I can understand DMC4, tekken and even MGS4 BUT killzone?





    Would people be attracted to a system if they showed pre-rendered footage from Driv3r, cat woman or some other bad game?

    Reply
  • Shinei - Friday, May 20, 2005 - link

    Oh man, I hope they offer wired controllers--I'm not in the mood to pay for the unit, the games, the controllers, XBox Live, AND batteries for the damn controllers. F that right in its overused A.
    Other than that, good condensation of all known data for XBox 2. I'm still on the fence about buying one, but that's only because the game lineup is so weak right now (and KillZone 2 is SO promising)...

    ps, first post with constructive content, OWNED nubcakes.
    Reply

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