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  • gherald - Wednesday, July 21, 2004 - link

    Must be something wrong with firefox then, because I've tried disabled all popup protection to the point where I get a lot of ads at other sites, but still cannot open this comments page.

    Even if it works perfectly for everyone else in the world, I still say it's stupid to have this in a popup.

    -posted from opera
  • TrogdorJW - Tuesday, July 20, 2004 - link

    #21 - does the registry corrupt itself, or does the user cause the corruption, or is it spyware/virus/trojan related? I'm betting on the last more than the others. Of course, if you're constantly tweaking your setup, problems can occur, but that happens with ANY operating system. Hell, after getting XP configured and setup properly, I didn't need to do a reinstall for over two years, and the only reason I ended up reinstalling was when my motherboard died on me.

    The only thing MS really needs to fix now is some of the default settings. Storing individual temp files for each user? Why would we actually want that? Setting aside 10% of your hard drive space for Temporary Internet Files (which are almost never used), and another 10% for System Restore!? That's stupid. If you need to use System Restore to return to a point more than three months in the past, there's a decent chance it won't work or will cause more problems than it fixes. However, these aren't huge problems; they're just annoyances.
  • sprockkets - Tuesday, July 20, 2004 - link

    No operating system should fatally crash by simply ending task or terminating a process.

    You are right 18#, it isn't hard keeping it clean, but then again I end up reinstalling it about every 8 months since the registry corrupts itself, not fatally, but just to make your favorite app not work anymore, or it take forever to boot up.
  • kd4yum - Tuesday, July 20, 2004 - link

    Kristopher: Any idea whatever happened to the MSI K8N 939-pin motherboard you folks used in the High End System Guide a few weeks ago? I can not find that motherboard anywhere. Has MSI scrapped it? When and where will it be for sale?
  • balzi - Tuesday, July 20, 2004 - link

    #15 -- I think something screwed up on the articles Gaming Benchmarks. UT2004 has a native Linux 64 bit version - so it would run a 64bit app. on 64 bit drivers, and i assume they saw awesome FPS gains. however this page:
    has no graphs relating to UT2004 64bit.. hmm?!?!?

    On the SATA RAID support.. I just bought a ASUS K8V (K8T800) .. granted it's a S754 board but the VIA southbridge remains the same [8237] I think.. anyway.. I had big problems getting hte RAID going, in fact I didn't get it going and had to opt for the Promise RAID controller onboard.. Gigabit Ethernet was provided by a Marvel Yukon chipset.. ASUS chose good here.. SuSE 9.0 picked it up eventually. though not straigth away.

    I sincerely hope VIA see some of these comments about their on-die SATA RAID support for Linux.

    as a consolation - I used the VIA instructions with some minor changes to get the Promise controller going.. they were sufficiently vague yet all-encompassing to be applicable. :)

  • tfranzese - Tuesday, July 20, 2004 - link

    Linux isn't without it's problems #17. I wish I had the time or willingness to get more into Linux, but for all my needs (programming) it gets the job done without me having to spend too much time learning anything extra. Bashing Windows is quite sad though on all your parts, it isn't too hard to keep a clean and stable Windows installation. Reply
  • sprockkets - Tuesday, July 20, 2004 - link

    The last BSOD I got on someone's computer was simply to end process on a trojan horse in winxp. Sad. Reply
  • tfranzese - Monday, July 19, 2004 - link

    I can't remember the last time I had a BSOD when I wasn't messing with my hardware setup changing things around.

    I'm sad for people who still live in the past.
  • TrogdorJW - Monday, July 19, 2004 - link

    #14 - Oh, yeah, I get blue screens ALL the time while gaming on XP. Mostly, it involves underwater scenes, though. Last time I had a BSOD on XP? Probably a few weeks ago. Last time I had a BSOD on a system that wasn't *overclocked*? I can't even remember.

    On the article:
    "Mental ray seems optimized for NVIDIA, but it does not seem to provide a distinct advantage going from 32-bit to 64-bit architecture." Duh - you mention that only a 32-bit version is available, so why should it benefit at all from 64-bit? Unlike games, which rely heavily on graphics drivers, Mental Ray is more of a CPU dependent application, so 64-bit graphics drivers aren't going to help it score higher.

    "Surprisingly, the difference between 64-bit and 32-bit UT2004 was a little more than we expected. The case for 64-bit is extremely strong with this benchmark." I'm a little confused here - it seems to me that the difference between 32-bit and 64-bit was much larger on W:ET than on UT2K4. Still, it's good to see *any* performance increase under 64-bit for a game. Is UT2K4 actually available in both 32-bit and 64-bit Linux binaries now? That wasn't made entirely clear in the article. IIRC, you're still running UT2K4 as a 32-bit game on a 64-bit OS, right? Only the drivers are 64-bit enabled.

    Overall, though, great article. With the updated Nvidia graphics drivers that provide support for 4K stack kernels (like Fedora Core 2), things are getting better. On a side note, I was finally able to get the Nvidia driver to run properly on my friend's 3000+ system (Chaintech ZNF-250 motherboard) by installing it manually from the command line and then run SaX2 to configure X. The old Nvidia driver crashed the system when I tried to install it, although AT never seemed to have that problem.
  • MNKyDeth - Monday, July 19, 2004 - link

    10 - Posted on Jul 19, 2004 at 1:23 PM by tfranzese
    "hardcore linux gamer", I'm sad for you. ;)

    Yeah, well, some of us would rather play the games linux has and not have to worry about a blue screen while we play. I won't use wine or wineX either, unless it upports 90% of all windows games and works 100% all the time.
  • RyanVM - Monday, July 19, 2004 - link

    It seems to me that optimizing the binaries would certainly be useful for seeing just how good performance can be. The vast majority of Linux users will be compiling their own code anyway... Reply
  • sprockkets - Monday, July 19, 2004 - link

    Hmmmm, although you say that you didn't optimize using flags during compile of Lame or anything else compiled, doesn't the configure script do this for you automatically, or at least, detect your processor type and compile accordingly?

    Comments on chipset support: It is nice to be able to install SuSE without a floppy, unlike EVERY version of windows out there. Did the SATA work though on the NF3? Sound would work since it's just the usual Intel 8x0 driver, right?
    VIA audio to some extent works on my motherboard with the 8237 SB, and while the codec seems fully supported, which is a SoundMAX, sound only came out once.
    I wouldn't call the fact that the kernel calls the chipset the K8T400 a necessary gotcha. One of the best things I like about linux is the fact that it refers to hardware by either it's real name or codename, unlike stupid windows which refers you your hardware from the marketed name of the product, making you think it really is something unique. For instance, SuSE 9.1 refers to the 964L SB from SIS as having a 963 ATA controller. On the outside it says 964L, but really, it probably uses the same IDE controller from before.
  • KristopherKubicki - Monday, July 19, 2004 - link

    Doom3 get a linux port but probably not right away. You all know we will have benchmarks first :)

  • tfranzese - Monday, July 19, 2004 - link

    "hardcore linux gamer", I'm sad for you. ;)

    Anyway, there's no need to included UT2K3 when they've got UT2K4 to benchmark. Including Quake3 is old and tired. Is Doom3 getting a Linux port?
  • MNKyDeth - Monday, July 19, 2004 - link

    I am very glad to see linux benches from a reputable site for a change. It's just nice having some hard numbers/facts, that I can use to compare my hardware choices with. I am a hardcore linux gamer and would like to make a suggestion if possible. RTCW:ET and UT2k4 are great benches, but there are many other games you can bench with on linux like Savage and Quake3, UT2k3 and maybe even Medal of Honor:AA. It's just a suggestion to include more games if you do a vid card roundup on linux later on or even if it is just a small comparison. Reply
  • RZaakir - Monday, July 19, 2004 - link

    Javescript links are wacky no matter how you look at it. There are myriad ways to design links to work when Javascript is disabled.

    Anyhow, I echo #5. I am very encouraged by the performance gains that we are starting to see. Around 30% on UT2004 is amazing. Hopefully Microsoft will get their act together so that we'll start seeing similar performance on Win32.
  • Jeff7181 - Monday, July 19, 2004 - link

    It's just too bad a crappy FX5600 was used for the gaming tests. Couldn't at least have dug up a FX5900?

    Oh by the way... I'm writing this using Firefox as well... maybe someone needs to learn how to use Firefox's features that make it a "web browser of choice." :)
  • srMatanza - Monday, July 19, 2004 - link

    Another awesome article in an awesome series. I think it's great that quality linux benchmarking articles are finally starting to show up in reputable forums.

    I can't wait for the linux video comparison. I think a good 64-bit distro review would also serve a purpose, especially if it focused on usability and maturity.

    Keep up the good work.
  • AlexWade - Monday, July 19, 2004 - link

    WOW! Finally, some REAL benchmarks between 32-bit and 64-bit.

    And I must say, if gains were saw across the board with non-64-bit optimized code, imagine what the jump will be with 64-bit optimized code!
  • mjz5 - Monday, July 19, 2004 - link

    another reason to go the AMD route instead of intel Reply
  • JasonClark - Monday, July 19, 2004 - link

    Wacky javascript links? Javascript is a standard, and with the popup manager in firefox/mozilla I don't see the issue. Enable popups for the site and your done. Reply
  • Gholam - Monday, July 19, 2004 - link

    Eh, I'm writing this in Firefox :)

    Anyway, nice results. Looks like 64-bit support in applications is what it will take for A64 to battle P4 on it's remaining home turf (encoding). Then again, it'd be interesting to see these benchmarks include Nocona.
  • gherald - Monday, July 19, 2004 - link

    I find it annoying that I can never seem to get this comments page to loads in Mozilla Firefox, the Linux browser of choice.

    If you're going to write articles about Linux, at least design your site in such a way that it doesn't use wacky javascript popups.

    Personally, I think you should just make it a normal web link and be done with it.

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