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  • nopcbs - Thursday, December 25, 2003 - link

    I don't understand the big concern that people have with +/- write compatability. If you get a + camp burner with bitsetting capability that gets you access to virtually all set top players by setting the DVD book type to DVD-ROM on the disk you video create. The + camp recorders still read the - camp disks, too. The only thing you miss is the ability to write to - camp disks, but who cares unless you already have a bunch of them? The + disk are as easy or easier to find and often cheaper. The high speed (8x) - camp format seems to exist only in theory (the NEC 2500 MAY be an exception, no tests available as yet), too,while there are loads of + 8x burners around.

    Who needs - camp format write ability, in other words? The format should have died a peaceful death except for Pioneer's stubborness.

    Is there fault in my reasoning?


    - nopcbs
    Reply
  • SUOrangeman - Sunday, December 21, 2003 - link

    Forgot to mention, I think the NEC ND2500 claims to do 8x DVD-R.

    http://store.yahoo.com/livewarehouse/frfesashnd8x....

    -SUO
    Reply
  • SUOrangeman - Sunday, December 21, 2003 - link

    Speaking of the NuTech firmware ... did they deliver on the 15th?

    The NEC ND2500 id now available at LiveWarehouse.

    Pioneer A07 is supposed to show next month.

    I recently read that the Sony is dropping OptoRite-made drives and will now go with LiteOn units for 8x (DRU-530). I can only presume that the current 530s are equivalent to the DD401 while any forthcoming 530s will be equivalent to the 811.

    -SUO
    Reply
  • thepriceisright - Friday, December 19, 2003 - link

    I like the articles here but sometimes I wonder...

    The Liteon drive did exceptionally well other than the fact it doesn't burn at 8x like the plextor.

    I really *dislike* how you guys do the roundups sometimes its like comparing a 9600 to a 9800xt. No duh the 9800xt will win but sometimes price is a important deciding factor. This was just a example.

    Do a review with only top of the line drives either in stats or price ranges. Or if that review would be too short then use the skills that got you this job and add a note saying something along the lines of; “Although the cheaper Liteon drive did not come with the burning software I myself would like to of had the $100+ price tag makes it a tempting buy. If money was of no concern the Plextor drive is the Cadillac of dvd burners and is sure to be worthy of the hefty price tag.” Since I am not a reviewer I am sure you can use those skills to spruce it up.
    Reply
  • LoneWolf15 - Monday, December 15, 2003 - link

    I would have liked to see the firmware versions Anandtech posted listed under each review. Then we could tell if Nu-Tech has released new firmware for their writer, for example. It is a good reference.

    Aside from that it was an excellent article. Thanks very much for reviewing something I know we all want to know about.
    Reply
  • holymaniac - Monday, December 15, 2003 - link

    Anyone know which DVDRW is the quietest?
    Reply
  • KristopherKubicki - Monday, December 15, 2003 - link

    ChefJoe: It turns out the 107 drives probably will not be capable of 8X DVD-R (At least at Computex Taipei and COMDEX Las Vegas they were not). I'm willing to bet the delay in release is NEC and Pioneer working on making those drives 8X DVD-R capable. All our sources say its physically the pickup that is not capable of DVD-R 8X, not the burn strategies/firmware.


    Kristopher
    Reply
  • Boonesmi - Monday, December 15, 2003 - link

    i wish you had included the pioneer A06 drive Reply
  • ChefJoe - Sunday, December 14, 2003 - link

    Any news on the Pioneer A07 ? Back in September's plextor article it was said " Pioneer and NEC are both expected to produce 8X capable DVD+R and DVD-R capable drives in November (DVR-A07 and ND-2300A, respectively), but Plextor has the upper hand with market saturation and aggressive pricing. "

    I'm really interested in an 8x Pioneer.
    Reply
  • DonB - Sunday, December 14, 2003 - link

    I'd like to see it commented somewhere in DVD articles which drives (if any) are able to play any region DVDs and which are locked to a certain region. Reply
  • rms - Saturday, December 13, 2003 - link

    Why was there no identification/information on the physical drive used in these products? I'm disappointed.

    rms
    Reply
  • artifex - Saturday, December 13, 2003 - link

    Have you noticed that if you rip the ISO with DVDD, you need to burn it with that? I had trouble reading a DVD that I burned using Nero, but when I went back to DVDD for the burn it worked fine. Reply
  • KristopherKubicki - Saturday, December 13, 2003 - link

    I use K3B and DVDTools for linux as well. Nero is good, depends on what you end up doing with it though. For ISOs and GIs, DVD Decryptor and Alcohol 120% are my particular choice of poisons.

    Cheers,

    Kristopher
    Reply
  • sprockkets - Saturday, December 13, 2003 - link

    Haha, for some stupid reason that Sonic Software that came with my Lite On DVD+RW only drive said a new disc was already full or something stupid. Used nero from my other drive and works fine. Nero rocks, of course, under linux with SuSE and K3B and DVDtools it works fine too. Burns for me took around 13.5 min. Reply
  • KristopherKubicki - Friday, December 12, 2003 - link

    Belzer, I emailed Nic about it. I was in fact using 2.24

    Kristopher
    Reply
  • artifex - Friday, December 12, 2003 - link

    Hmmm turns out my drive is identical to the BTC 1004IM. What can I say? I don't see any drives using that base in the comparison either, though I hardly feel prejudiced against, like the Lite-On people :)

    Anyway, looks like it does what I need it to, even has Mount Rainier support (My RW5125A didn't according to DVDinfoPro), for 1/2 the Plextor or Sony, so I should live with it for a while, right? I mean... I'm used to burning DVDs at 2.4x anyway, and now I can use the - formats (yuck, if I have to).
    Reply
  • Belzer - Friday, December 12, 2003 - link

    Kristopher: I think the MCC 003 should be identified as 8x in the latest (2.24) version of DVDInfoPro too. Reply
  • artifex - Friday, December 12, 2003 - link

    Jeez, over $10? They must have a built-in Hollywood tax planned.

    I decided I couldn't wait. Fry's had a weird "Emprex" +- brand on sale for $90 before tax here in Dallas. I figure for under $100, I'll not worry about burning it up before Blu-ray... or whatever competes against it.

    I'll let you know how it works... so far I see the websites on the box don't have any info on the drive :( It does seem to have a reasonably complete set of software, though. If nothing else, I can use it a little while and exchange it.
    Reply
  • KristopherKubicki - Friday, December 12, 2003 - link

    Belzer: Youre probably right. In DVD Info Pro, I got this (14)

    http://images.anandtech.com/reviews/storage/roundu...

    Looks like the discs are just ahead of their time ;)

    Kristopher
    Reply
  • Belzer - Friday, December 12, 2003 - link

    Thanks for the update, Kristopher! Sorry if I sounded rude in my last post.

    About the Verbatim media:
    MCC 001 = 2.4x, MCC 002 = 4x, MCC 003 = 8x

    Check Philips' list with approved media:
    http://www.licensing.philips.com/services/db/midco...

    or check this thread:
    http://www.cdrlabs.com/phpBB/viewtopic.php?t=13821

    or check Plextor's list of compatible media:
    http://www.plextor.com/english/support/media_708Co...

    or check for yourself with DVDIdentifier:
    http://dvd.identifier.cdfreaks.com/

    Verbatim probably hadn't the new 8x box art available yet so my guess is that they put the sample discs they sended to you in an old case.
    Reply
  • Icewind - Friday, December 12, 2003 - link

    Wait, so in the Avg Write Column in your XLS sheet, thats TIME not The actually speed of the burner itself?

    Ok, looking at it, the way you have it labeled it looks alot more like the average speed the burner BURNED at, not the actual time.
    Reply
  • KristopherKubicki - Friday, December 12, 2003 - link

    I apologize if there was a bias away from the LiteOn drive. It was unintentional.

    PXC, alexruiz: The DD0203 was originally supposed to be in this roundup, but I severed the cable taking it apart to look at the chipset :) It will be in the next roundup.

    Kristopher
    Reply
  • pxc - Friday, December 12, 2003 - link

    What's up with the anti-LiteOn bias in the article? It didn't fail any tests like the NEC 1300A did, but it's trashed from first mention and in the conclusion.

    #15, I can tell you why the DD020x wasn't included: it's junk. I've had one for over a month now and it has the worst media compatibility of any dual format drive. Even the media that generally works will also fail 20% of the time. It would do Optorite no good to have it's buggy drive compared to working drives.
    Reply
  • KristopherKubicki - Friday, December 12, 2003 - link

    My contacts at Plextor told me dual layer media is going to cost upwards of $10. Ill pass. I am more interested in BluRay anyway.

    Kristopher
    Reply
  • artifex - Friday, December 12, 2003 - link

    I'd be willing to pay more than double the then DVD+R price for DVD+R dual layer media, assuming that hard drive prices haven't gone down much before then. Reply
  • KristopherKubicki - Friday, December 12, 2003 - link

    Belzer: Thank you for the feedback. I do appreciate your thoroughness and I have corrected a number of errors.

    I do digress concerning the MCC 003 Media, however. Not only does DVD Info Pro identify the media as 4X write, but the Verbatim box art also identifies the media as "1-4X".

    I have all of the images from CDSpeed, so it looks like i will be spending the rest of my friday uploading them and inserting them into the article. :)

    Good to be done with finals ;)

    Kristopher
    Reply
  • alexruiz - Friday, December 12, 2003 - link

    A little surprised to find that some other available burners were not included:

    1) One of the most popular dual burners WAS NOT included (Optorite DD0203/DD0201) Furthermore, there is already available the 8x "+" version (DD0401)

    2) Another one is the BTC 1004IM, or the big brother, the 8x 1008IM that is supposed to write DVD-R at 8x also...

    Chistpher, can we include the Optorite DD0401 AND the BTC 1008IM for the next review?


    Alex
    Reply
  • michec - Friday, December 12, 2003 - link

    When was this review done? The 8X dual-format Lite-On drive is not a drive that is being anticipated - it's already available. I got mine on Nov 30th at a local computer show. Why bother with reviewing 4x drives when there is a 8x version that is available? What a waste of time and energy reviewing the 4x Lite-On. Reply
  • LoneWolf1 - Friday, December 12, 2003 - link

    In regards to #8. You may download our entire burn time spreadsheet.

    http://images.anandtech.com/reviews/storage/roundu...
    Reply
  • Icewind - Friday, December 12, 2003 - link

    Heres a link

    http://www.cdfreaks.com/news2.php?ID=8051
    Reply
  • Icewind - Friday, December 12, 2003 - link

    Last I heard, the dual layers wont be out till Summer 2004 #10 and your gonna be looking at major ouchy price too, especially for media. Reply
  • artifex - Friday, December 12, 2003 - link

    I have a Verbatim-badged Ricoh DVD+R(W) that's starting to get flaky, about a year and a half after I bought it and after burning less than 100 discs. Probably less than 50, actually.

    I'd like to see some tests that show burning/ripping a couple hundred discs, to see what really survives.

    Also, anyone have a good guess as to when dual-layer-capable drives will be out? I'd really like to see those come to market soon. I won't wait for Blu-ray, but I will wait for dual-layer if it's next quarter. Maybe I'll buy one of the cheap ones in the meantime if it's longer.
    Reply
  • BitByRabidAlgae - Friday, December 12, 2003 - link

    Icewind. I can tell you from my own experience that a full 4.7GB DVD+R or RW takes about 15mins to burn at 4x with my LiteOn drive using the MySonic software that came with it. The elapsed time from hitting the record button can vary depending on what kinds of files your burning. The software caches small files, if you have a lot of those, it takes a few mins to cache them all. A handful of large files though goes pretty fast and takes about 15 mins at 4x. Reply
  • Icewind - Friday, December 12, 2003 - link

    Wait I just noticed something, WHY are there no Burn TIMES anywhere? Thats what I like to know. How long TIME wise does it take to burn various media? How could you miss that AT? Reply
  • Icewind - Friday, December 12, 2003 - link

    Would you like some cheese with that whine #5? Reply
  • BitByRabidAlgae - Friday, December 12, 2003 - link

    For the record, I have a LiteOn 401S, and it has performed flawlessly for me. Another thing that was not addressed was the Sony drive's pitiful read speed on pressed DVD's. This is NOT a bug. It is intentional. When the drive detects a copy-protected DVD, it locks the read speed at 2x. So, if you're looking for a drive to rip DVD's with, the Sony is a poor choice. Unless you don't mind waiting an hour to rip a 2 hour movie, when other drives can do it in 10-15 minutes. I suppose we should expect something like this from a company that owns a movie studio.

    Also, can anyone confirm the rumor that flashing the 411S BIOS in to my 401S will make it a dual format drive?
    Reply
  • Belzer - Friday, December 12, 2003 - link

    Imho there are too many errors in the review to be acceptable. It can't be that hard to get the specifications of the burners etc. correct can it? Because with so many errors at least I can't trust any of the numbers in the review. Anyway here are the errors I've found when I skimmed through the review:

    Plextor: "but it also claims 16X DVD read speeds"
    Plextor, ASUS, MSI drives only read DVDs in max 12x, not 16x (the specs in the review are also wrong for these drives).

    Sony: "Since the only real difference between the DRU-530A and the Plextor 708A is the 8MB buffer"
    Sony DRU-530A also only has a 2 MB buffer, not 8 MB.

    "The drive came with an average software package, including PowerDVD and Sonic MyDVD — not quite as complete as Sony or Nu Tech's bundle."
    The Lite-On drive also comes with Sonic Recordnow and Sonic DLA (it's on the same CD as MyDVD).

    "even if the drive is a slight step down from the LDW-401S, which can burn 8X DVD+R"
    No, LDW-401S burns DVD+R in max 4x. LDW-811S on the other hand burns DVD+R in 8x.

    NEC: "DVD+RW Rewrite Speed 4X, 2.4X (CLV)"
    DVD+RW write speed is max 2.4x on the ND-1300A.

    DVD+R: "MMC 003 — 4X DVD+R"
    DVD-R: "MMC01RG20 — 4X DVD-R"
    Should be "MCC 003 — 8X DVD+R" and "MCC 01RG20 — 4X DVD-R". MCC stands for Mitsubishi Chemical Corporation and the MCC 003 is 8x media. MMC is Mitsubish Material Corporation and is not related to Mitsubishi's media manufacturing. MMC is also incorrectly mentioned several times in the text.

    "PHILIPS 041 — 4X DVD+RW" and "RICOHJPNW11 — 4X DVD+RW"
    No way that the Asus, MSI and NEC can have burned these media in 4x as they burn DVD+RW in only 2.4x.
    Reply
  • DragonReborn - Friday, December 12, 2003 - link

    nice review...I think the ASUS/106 should get a little more attention. You can find that drive OEM for $120-130 and is really is awesome. The one "flaw" is that it doesn't read cd's as fast as the new boys...but who has a DVD burner that doesn't have a dedicated CD/burner? Now that I think of it...probably more than few. Well then. Reply
  • Icewind - Friday, December 12, 2003 - link

    Wish I knew when The next speed DVD R/RW's are gonna come out so I know if it was worth waiting.

    I got 50+ burned CDs on my desk I just have to reduce.
    Reply
  • wicktron - Friday, December 12, 2003 - link

    where's the 811s? Reply
  • wicktron - Friday, December 12, 2003 - link

    props Reply

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