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  • ddriver - Wednesday, March 29, 2017 - link

    Hate the lack of symmetry at the back. The sensor should have been under the camera, the flash - on top of it. Reply
  • Cellar Door - Wednesday, March 29, 2017 - link

    Do you also hate the lack of symmetry on your own face? Because it is not perfectly symmetrical.

    What a stupid comment..
    Reply
  • ddriver - Wednesday, March 29, 2017 - link

    Actually the flash array and text would be more than enough to break the perfect symmetry, while still presenting an aesthetic view.

    I did say "symmetry", and not "perfect symmetry". What would have been sensible for samsung to do would still have a degree of asymmetry in line with the kind we see in the physical characteristics of normal human beings.

    Bug talking about stupid comments, judging by yours, "normal human beings" excludes you, likely abnormally asymmetrical, due to severe inbreeding, detrimental to both looks and intellect.
    Reply
  • brutedawg - Wednesday, March 29, 2017 - link

    #rekt Reply
  • niva - Friday, March 31, 2017 - link

    The lack of symmetry in the back isn't as big a problem as how ugly the physical button made the previous gen phones from the front. I don't use fingerprint sensor anyways, always have PIN code required as input, so no big deal to me.

    I'm intrigued by the desktop feature and what that might bring about in terms of functionality. Wasn't expecting that from Samsung.

    Bottom line, the good: looks, display, waterproof
    Bad: fingerprint sensor position is questionable, touchwiz (the terrible abomination that will bring your device to a crawl within a few weeks/months and pretty much guarantees lack of updates or severe delays)

    I'll stay away due to touchwiz, but props to Samsung for the general design decisions. First Samsung phone that actually appeals to me since the Galaxy Nexus (mine still works!)
    Reply
  • Ratman6161 - Monday, April 03, 2017 - link

    If you don't like touchwiz you know you don't have to use it right? Install a third party launcher and disable and set it as the default (and go a step further and disable touchwiz if desired). This works fine with my Note 5 so I'm assuming it will with the S8 too. I happen to use Nova Launcher (though there are many alternatives) and use package disabler to disable touchwiz.

    So not buying the phone solely because you don't like touchwiz doesnt make a lot of sense to me. Personally, I'm not getting an S8 because I like my pen on my Note 5 and also because the performance on the Note 5 is more than adequate to my needs...so no need for a new phone to begin with.
    Reply
  • hp79 - Tuesday, April 04, 2017 - link

    Actually, TouchWiz is not just a skin deep. It's integrated everywhere in the OS. I hated that every time I raise the volume or turn off data or sync or whatever, I get warning message that I can't turn off without rooting it. Rooting it makes SamsungPay useless and device unstable or not energy efficient so it's not desirable anymore. I don't understand why they have to change some things just for the sakes of the change. If it weren't for that, I probably would have stuck with S7 Edge or any future Samsung phones. No more Samsung Galaxy phones for me though. Oh, and don't forget battery drain on Samsung phones. Probably due to bad software from Samsung. Reply
  • BurntMyBacon - Wednesday, April 05, 2017 - link

    @Ratman6161

    niva mentions both performance and lack of (or severely delayed) updates as issues attributable to touchwiz. While your solution may help (touchwiz is more than just a launcher) with some of the performance issues, Samsung certainly isn't going to give you updates for a longer period or in a more timely fashion just because you disabled the touchwiz launcher.
    Reply
  • marcolorenzo - Sunday, April 02, 2017 - link

    Wow, talk about spin! When people say symmetry, they are implying perfect symmetry. Look up the word's definition before using it next time. Reply
  • sl0wcheetah - Wednesday, April 05, 2017 - link

    I like you! Reply
  • WinterCharm - Wednesday, March 29, 2017 - link

    Symmetry is good. Quit being a samsung fanboy. Reply
  • close - Wednesday, March 29, 2017 - link

    You're talking about looks. Which are inherently subjective. How many times did you feel the need to ask anybody else what looks good? Reply
  • ddriver - Wednesday, March 29, 2017 - link

    It might appear that it is subjective, but only to those, unaware of the roots of the human notion of engineering aesthetics.

    We humans don't really invent a lot, what we do most of the time is copy. We copy what nature has already done. Most of what nature does is symmetrical, with very few exceptions. And there is a good, functional reason for it. And as a result, most of what we do is symmetrical too - cars, planes, ships, guns...

    We mostly break symmetry for ergonomics, but that means while a product gets optimized for a right-handed person, that makes it intrinsically a poor experience in the hands of a lefty. And vice versa.

    This would be the case of this product too, while decent for a right handed person, the sensor placing is just too awkward for a left handed person, and even if those represent a mere 10% of the population, in that particular case it would have been very easy to have the best of both worlds by placing the sensor under the camera and moving the camera up a couple of notches.

    Funny how superficial and silly some people are, immediately assuming I was taking exclusively about looks. And kind of paradoxical, since they only do that because they themselves only care about the looks, while at the same time not having the standards to judge looks aesthetics.

    And yes, it would have also looked better, on top of being more practical, had the design been more symmetrical. It is important to also note the difference between "good design" and "pretty design" - good design is intrinsically practical, if it is not practical, then it is bad design, even if it is pretty. Good - bad, ugly - pretty. A design can be good even if ugly, or bad even if pretty, naturally, it is always best if you can have it both good and pretty, which this product could have easily been, but alas.

    That's the problem with the industry, they have it cozy and easy because people are for most parts dumb, so rather than having consumers know and dictate then industry what they need and want, the industry would convince people what they want and have a blast selling them what can easily qualify for useless garbage relative to the full extent of the technological potential. They know they can get away with making products that are a fraction of the functionality, versatility, durability and value they can be, because that is in their best interest, which is making as much money as possible, which involves giving as little as possible to consumers while taking as much as possible from them. Which is how we get to have products with such blatantly obvious shortcomings. And the sensor position is just the tip of a very big iceberg. Luckily, most people don't know what they are missing, they go with the flow and do not complain, because they have no clue how much better, more useful and beneficial technology could be. So rather than having the optimal, we get barely incremental stuff, propped up by hype and useless gimmicks, where consumer use is just a screen to cover up the fact that this product is only 10% about the consumer using it, and 90% about the consumer being used through it. Hence we have powerful hardware that could have been extremely useful, yet is limited to a limited use toy, a money milking machine and a spyware / privacy invasion platform.
    Reply
  • Reflex - Wednesday, March 29, 2017 - link

    "So rather than having the optimal"

    This amused me. As an engineer in the hardware and software industry, what is 'optimal' varies user to user. There is no such thing as universally optimal anything. There is this notion that products are developed sub-optimally for the lowest common denominator, but in truth that is not the case. Products are differentiated from each other to capture what is the closest to optimal for a subset of the potential customer base. Just because something is sub-optimal to one person does not make it less than optimal or close to optimal for another. There is a reason Samsung releases 3-5 variants of every major iteration of their product lines.

    I can argue with my brother all day that my Sennheiser's are better than his Beats headphones by any objective analysis. I can argue that they are optimal for anyone who values quality sound at several given price points. But that is only because what is optimal for me is not optimal for him. He values appearance, style and social cache. I do not share those metrics as important. That does not mean my metrics are any more or less valuable than his. After all, as he would remind me, his hearing was damaged significantly during the Iraq war, he is unable to really discern the level of detail I can and all of the additional clarity I get from my Senns is wasted on him. At a given price point, why wouldn't he get the set of cans he finds more attractive?

    Optimal is in the eyes (and requirements) of the beholder.
    Reply
  • Meteor2 - Thursday, March 30, 2017 - link

    Reflex, that's a really insightful comment. Thank you. Reply
  • lilmoe - Thursday, March 30, 2017 - link

    +1
    It gets tiring arguing with people about what's optimal.
    Reply
  • ddriver - Thursday, March 30, 2017 - link

    Just because you cannot abstract from your subjectivity doesn't mean objectivity is unattainable to anyone.

    The opinion of the ignorant generally doesn't matter. People are often dumb enough to convince them into believing the most preposterous stuff. A rapist probably believes that raping people is a good thing too, but that doesn't make it so by any measure, regardless of his personal beliefs.

    Arguing is pointless, I do not argue, I just tell how things are. If you want to argue, knock yourself out. My opinions are very well substantiated by fact, logic and reason, and back in the days when I still used to argue, I found out that people I argued with couldn't really make a substantiated argument, because the opinions they advocate aren't the product of logic and reason to begin with.

    Imagine a car, but not just a car you could drive anywhere there is road with, but a car you whose software only allows you to drive it to very specific places, not that much where you want to go, but where someone else wants you to.

    That's the kind of limitations and deviations from the "optimal" I talk about. Because today phones are just as capable as the general purpose computers of 10 years ago, yet none of that functionality is available, which is not optimal. Not only that, we are seeing general purpose computers going the same way too, turning more and more into walled gardens, before long it may be considered a criminal offense to even own a general purpose computer that you can do whatever you want with, rather than only what say M$ wants you to.

    This is not optimal. And I don't mean subjectively, but objectively, granted, corporations would be very happy about that, so you could say it would be subjectively optional for them to further reduce the value of their products and increase their control. But I didn't talk about "subjective" to begin with, you understood it as such because evidently you haven't reached the milestone that is discovery of the objective and absolute. But you will not find it until you manage to outgrow yourself.
    Reply
  • ddriver - Thursday, March 30, 2017 - link

    Also, claiming to be an engineer, and then claiming that Li-Po batteries regrade less than Li-Ion is kinda contradictory. I'd expect an actual engineer to be aware that the two technologies are very much identical in terms of cell durability, rather than to throw around urban legends how Li-Po "solved" degradation. Reply
  • Retycint - Thursday, March 30, 2017 - link

    >"A rapist probably believes that raping people is a good thing too"
    >"My opinions are very well substantiated by fact, logic and reason"
    Are you even listening to yourself
    Reply
  • Meteor2 - Thursday, March 30, 2017 - link

    To be honest I'm concerned about ddriver's mental health, but this isn't the place to discuss it or do anything about it. Reply
  • lilmoe - Thursday, March 30, 2017 - link

    The "misalignment" of the ports and buttons adds strength to the structure of the frame. Just like a brick wall. That's also objectively true...

    Symmetry, where it really counts is objectively best when it comes to industrial design. If said symmetry comes with compromise to the internal structure, then its meaningless.
    Reply
  • negusp - Thursday, March 30, 2017 - link

    There are plenty of phones with generally symmetrical placements of items on the back and very good durability.

    Your argument makes no sense. Why sacrifice ergonomics for maybe a very slight reinforcement which means almost nothing in that the entire phone is fucking glass?
    Reply
  • lilmoe - Thursday, March 30, 2017 - link

    Glass is there for a reason; better reception and wireless charging.
    The fingerprint scanner is there because time ran out while trying (with Synaptics) to incorporate it beneath the screen (according to reports).

    My argument makes the most sense. They've been called out several times by iShills about the "misalignment" of the ports, yet are still there. The most obvious reason is structural integrity. What doesn't make sense is claiming that this alignment lacks "attention to detail". Damn, I get goosebumps just listening to that stupid, incomprehensible rhetoric.

    But then again, if this oh-so-awful "misalignment" bothers you so much, you're free to ignore this phone altogether. But stop with the petty arguments.
    Reply
  • Reflex - Thursday, March 30, 2017 - link

    "I just tell how things are."

    For you.
    Reply
  • marcolorenzo - Sunday, April 02, 2017 - link

    I think you should stop with the metaphors, you're clearly not very good at them. Reply
  • close - Thursday, March 30, 2017 - link

    @Reflex, sometimes I think ddriver is just fishing for compliments. For every 10 people laughing at him there will be one admiring his persistence in useless drivel and he'll eat that compliment up like there's no tomorrow.

    Why then even mundane products that have been around forever look very different from 10 or 20 years ago? Why are most cars or hairdos of the 80s considered garish today? Why over the years even preference in women has changed although you would assume something so basic would change at the rate of evolution? I won't even get into the many cultures that appreciate asymmetry and irregularity. Maybe they're not reading the correct comment sections...

    Also I think he confuses the usefulness of a technology or the optimal placement of a component with aesthetics.
    Practical = ergonomics. Aesthetics = beauty. And he'll have to ripen a little more before he stops trying to conclusively define "beauty" in exact terms and assume those terms apply to everything and everyone.
    Reply
  • Shadow7037932 - Friday, March 31, 2017 - link

    Do you really have nothing better to do with your life than constantly post comments on AnandTech? Reply
  • F1shbone - Thursday, March 30, 2017 - link

    Do you have some inside knowledge to substantiate your claim that it would have been "very easy" to place the fingerprint reader and camera differently? Don't get me wrong, I agree with most people that a lower, centered placement for the reader would have been better, but I'm sure you agree that they must have considered that option. This leads me to believe that they had good reasons not to take that route. In short they had to give up that design win for other ones they valued more. And those other wins might have been practical, aesthetic, cost sensitive etc. Without having intimate insight into the design process there's really no way of knowing, but I tend to believe the decision to place the sensor more conveniently would most definitely NOT have been easy or otherwise they would have done it. Reply
  • negusp - Thursday, March 30, 2017 - link

    @F1shbone
    I'm pretty sure they planned an under-screen design, but they had to rush the phone to market.

    Thus we have a phone with very poorly-thought-out ergonomics. Typical sammy.
    Reply
  • lilmoe - Thursday, March 30, 2017 - link

    "poorly-thought-out ergonomics. Typical sammy."
    Exactly. Like how the S7 and Note7 are poor-thought-out. You believe they should wait several more months for Synaptics to finalize the below-screen sensor? You want them to incorporate a smaller battery for the sensor to fit in the middle like what LG did? Is this, by any way, worse than omitting the headphone jack to "incorporate a larger taptic engine"??? Laughable.

    Just stop it guys. There isn't a phone out there with better ergonomics that has a crap-ton of best-in-class features with the least amount of compromise. It's just not technically possible ATM, but it should be when the Note8 is announced.
    Reply
  • F1shbone - Thursday, March 30, 2017 - link

    I agree. Samsung usually comes up with two flagships a year so they incorporate what technology they can at that point. There is always a rush to the market. There is always the next model. Moreover this is a crucial phone for them to get back on track in a timely manner after the Note 7 fiasco. Over all the placement of the fingerprint scanner is just a minor nuisance, especially considering the iris and face unlocking. More importantly the phone is gorgeous! And from videos I've seen it's ergonomics in hand are a step up from earlier iterations. Also the looks and design are super important as I believe that's the thing to set the S8 apart from (way cheaper) competition and help justify it's price point to more people. The current fingerprint reader placement was just the best compromise at the time with the new synaptics sensor not yet ready to ship. Reply
  • lolipopman - Saturday, April 01, 2017 - link

    By that logic, nothing is subjective. Would you agree that it is instinctual and in human nature to find fat people ugly, disgusting and revolting? Reply
  • marcolorenzo - Sunday, April 02, 2017 - link

    Nature is symmetrical? Maybe metaphorically as in, what goes up must come down; every action has an equal opposite reaction blah blah blah but in terms of actual appearance, it is certainly not symmetrical in most cases. Ever seen a perfectly symmetrical tree?
    Anyways, I would've argued that Samsung tried too hard to be symmetrical by placing the fingerprint scanner next to the camera to counterbalance the flash on the other side.
    Reply
  • Ratman6161 - Monday, April 03, 2017 - link

    "they have it cozy and easy because people are for most parts dumb"
    I would replace "dumb" with " uninformed. its pretty typical techno geek to consider people dumb because they don't understand. I myself am a techno geek and I've been fighting this attitude that the user is dumb so hard and so long I'm about ready to give up and retire.
    Users are not dumb...they just don't know as much as you do, so try a little harder to educate without the name calling.
    Reply
  • masouth - Tuesday, August 01, 2017 - link

    I agree with you mostly Ratman but unfortunately there are still large numbers of dumb users out there. Not just ignorant, dumb.

    Although I have found that the ones who willfully acknowledge that they are ignorant or dumb can also tend to be some of the best people to work with/ for since they don't let their ego get in the way of what you are trying to do...at least not nearly as much as the ones who think that they know it all.
    Reply
  • Jon Tseng - Wednesday, March 29, 2017 - link

    >Do you also hate the lack of symmetry on your own face? Because it is not perfectly symmetrical.

    Um, you do know a human face and a smartphone are different things?

    Pretty stupid to compare them according to the same criteria. Thats like saying you dont like someones face because it very hard to read text from it in low light conditions...
    Reply
  • mkozakewich - Wednesday, March 29, 2017 - link

    Relationship problems. Reply
  • close - Thursday, March 30, 2017 - link

    If you can pick "symmetry" as the unquestionable mark of beauty then why can't I pick "ability to display high contrast illuminated text" as one? I think everyone agrees fuzzy, illegible text sucks but not everyone agrees that symmetry is the best (which is why probably half of the products around you aren't perfectly symmetrical). Reply
  • RMSe17 - Wednesday, March 29, 2017 - link

    Cellar Door - don't be evil. Reply
  • Reflex - Wednesday, March 29, 2017 - link

    You should just do what I do. Remove the guts of the phone and make note of where items need to be. Pop the problem into SolidWorks and design a new casing that puts the items you want to move where they need to be, then hit up a CNC shop for a custom manufactured casing. It's a bit more work, but you will have a more durable product that lasts longer, and less design irritation.

    ;)
    Reply
  • JoeyJoJo123 - Wednesday, March 29, 2017 - link

    Nice burn, given ddriver's shitpost concerning just CNCing a customer case the other article. Reply
  • ddriver - Wednesday, March 29, 2017 - link

    How is it a burn? Or a shit post? Because it would be vastly superior solution? Yeah, we cannot have that, right, because we are proud cattle that takes pride in its mediocrity. Reply
  • Retycint - Thursday, March 30, 2017 - link

    The amount of delusion in this post alone shows how much actual "fact, logic and reasoning" you actually use Reply
  • Reflex - Thursday, March 30, 2017 - link

    My guess is he's somewhere on the spectrum. Which is fine. He certainly is sub-optimal socially. ;) Reply
  • iranterres - Wednesday, March 29, 2017 - link

    Considering pictures will be taken mostly with the fone tilted horizontaly, I suppose the flash position is just OK, but i guess you're right about the fingerprint sensor. Reply
  • StevoLincolnite - Wednesday, March 29, 2017 - link

    Doesn't bother me. I just hate having crap glass on the back. It makes the device feel more fragile, so it never leaves it's case which undermines the entire point of it. Reply
  • mr_tawan - Thursday, March 30, 2017 - link

    I don't see the flash's location being a problem, but, you're right, the sensor shouldn't be there. Reply
  • Samus - Thursday, March 30, 2017 - link

    The problem with the location of the components is you are likely to get your fingerprints on the camera lens... Reply
  • Rod_Serling_Lives - Saturday, April 01, 2017 - link

    Completely agree. This is called logic. The fingerprint sensor is poorly placed and lazy on their part. Reply
  • leo_sk - Thursday, March 30, 2017 - link

    Totally agree Reply
  • hp79 - Tuesday, April 04, 2017 - link

    I don't really mind the non-symmetry, and they are trying to get things aligned, however that fingerprint reader placement will cause tons of finger print on the camera. Very bad place to have a fingerprint reader. Reply
  • twtech - Wednesday, March 29, 2017 - link

    I'm still using an S5 that I replaced the battery in several times. Wouldn't have been able to do that with Samsung's newer phones.

    I've also dropped it a few times over the past several years - no worse for wear because I have a cover on it. What kind of cover can you put on a phone with no bezels without covering up the display?

    At least wireless charging is now a standard feature - the charging port seems to usually be one of the first things to wear out.

    If I were using my phone exclusively at a desk or something, I'd consider this - it looks it's a very sleek, elegant device - but it doesn't seem like it would last carrying it around everywhere for daily use.
    Reply
  • ddriver - Wednesday, March 29, 2017 - link

    User-replaceable battery FTW. Dumbsung could have saved billions in the note 7 fiasco if they had just gone for the replaceable battery pretty much everyone wants. Sealed glass bricks? Not for me thanks, for me this is a tool and it needs to be practical and versatile, not a fashion accessory. Reply
  • artk2219 - Wednesday, March 29, 2017 - link

    Agreed, honestly it's why im against glass and metal in phones period, and thats all that "premium" phones are made of. Theres nowhere for any impacts to go other than to the weakest component, aka they screen or back if it is also glass. Plastic will flex and absorb some of the shock, or fly apart and deflect the energy if you still have a phone with a separate back and battery. Honestly I'm sure they dont care, they make more money from you having to repair or buy a new phone. Reply
  • melgross - Wednesday, March 29, 2017 - link

    Yeah, I used to see phones with replaceable batteries fly apart when they were dropped. And then the owners couldn't put them back together again. Yup, that was just great! Reply
  • ddriver - Wednesday, March 29, 2017 - link

    Perhaps people should work more on their motor skills. Phones aren't meant for dropping. But even then, better to absorb the shock by flying apart than by shattering that glass. Reply
  • fanofanand - Wednesday, March 29, 2017 - link

    I must have dropped my Galaxy S2 50 times before it finally broke, my Nexus 4 had a shattered screen within 7 days of ownership. I will never purchased another glass-backed phone again.

    Full disclosure: I am clumsy and refuse to use a phone case.
    Reply
  • Meteor2 - Wednesday, March 29, 2017 - link

    I do recommend a flappy case. It's a case of when will you drop it, not if. Reply
  • StevoLincolnite - Friday, March 31, 2017 - link

    Glass is certainly shit on the back of a Phone. Reply
  • twtech - Wednesday, March 29, 2017 - link

    I agree that you should try not to drop your phone. But if you're handling it daily for (hopefully) years, what are the odds that it will never happen even once?

    Most of the times when my phone hit the deck, it was actually when I was getting out of my car. The phone had slid toward the top of my pocket while I was driving, and then when I was getting out, the phone slipped out and hit the pavement.

    Not often, mind you, only maybe five or six drops total over 3 years so far, but if the phone is unprotected even once could be too much.
    Reply
  • artk2219 - Wednesday, March 29, 2017 - link

    Yup, because you were then either replacing a back or a battery, typically not the main unit. Reply
  • PVG - Wednesday, March 29, 2017 - link

    Making stuff up to prove a false point, are we?

    My plastic S3 Mini has fallen countless times, flew apart almost every one of them, allways got back together.
    Is on it's 4th battery.
    Never had any cases or covers, apart from a screen protecting film and is still in one piece, without even a scratch on the screen.

    Is approaching 5 VERY USED years in my hands (or, Everything makers don't want).

    I dare anyone to get the same mileage from any of this modern "premium", sealed, resource wasting, pieces of crap.
    I know I can't, and will be lucky if my next phone lasts half as much.
    Reply
  • Meteor2 - Wednesday, March 29, 2017 - link

    My S3 mini was a back-up phone that I hardly used... and expired after two years. The screen just shows random coloured dots.

    Anecdotes suck.
    Reply
  • mkozakewich - Wednesday, March 29, 2017 - link

    My Note II died the first week I had it, but the replacement has lasted fine all these years. I don't use it anymore, though, in lieu of a newer $200 phone.
    My glass-and-metal Surface Pro (1st gen), meanwhile, is still serving me fine as a home computer. So, again, anecdotes.
    Reply
  • Notmyusualid - Friday, March 31, 2017 - link

    @ PVG

    Respect to anyone that can get such usage out of your devices, if it suits your needs.

    I only changed my GS5, because I needed dual-sim (tired to carrying around two phones). But I've a feeling I'd still be using it, had that not been the case.
    Reply
  • Solandri - Wednesday, March 29, 2017 - link

    A dropped phone has the same energy whether it's designed to come apart or not. If your phone is not designed to come apart and you drop it, that extra energy which would've gone into bending retaining clips and flinging the pieces apart, instead goes directly into the phone's components. So the single-piece phone actually suffers more internal damage from an equivalent drop than a phone designed to come apart. Reply
  • rabidpeach - Wednesday, March 29, 2017 - link

    if you can't put a battery in a phone, perhaps you are too stupid to wield the awesome power contained there-in. so yes it would be great if this bastard with moar money than brains was excluded from our mobile society. Reply
  • bcronce - Wednesday, March 29, 2017 - link

    Gorilla glass is incredibly flexible. If you separate the glass from the frame, you can get about a third of the way to having the two ends touch. iPhone uses a "liquid" metal frame that is a modern alloy that is very strong and flexible. Requires a great deal of distortion before it permanently deforms or suffers catastrophic failure.

    We're not quite there, but if you want slim, you have to give up being able to open it up.
    Reply
  • Jon Tseng - Wednesday, March 29, 2017 - link

    1) I'd need to check with Corning but pretty sure gorilla isn't that flexible. Were you thinking of Willow Glass?

    2) No the iPhone frame is not liquudmetal. It is aluminium, although there is some speculation about stainless steel in the 8. AFAIK liquudmetal has only ever been used by Apple in the SIM ejection tool.
    Reply
  • mkozakewich - Wednesday, March 29, 2017 - link

    It's pretty flexible. I had the glass on one of my devices get shoved out at one corner, and the glass was curving up by a tremendous amount. Luckily, there was no damage and I got it back into place. Reply
  • melgross - Wednesday, March 29, 2017 - link

    No, not pretty much everyone, some. Replaceable batteries means smaller batteries, and there's simply no way to have any real water resistance with a replaceable battery. Forget it. Reply
  • ddriver - Wednesday, March 29, 2017 - link

    No it doesn't and yes there is. Reply
  • UglyFrank - Wednesday, March 29, 2017 - link

    The S5/S4 Active/S5 Active/S5 Neo/S5 Mini all had water resistance with removable back covers. Granted it was IP67 but it was still good. Reply
  • halcyon - Wednesday, March 29, 2017 - link

    LG G5 was waterproof enough for anything except constant diving use and had a replaceable battery. Nano-coating goes a long way:

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dqXJHn-Us9U
    Reply
  • rpmrush - Thursday, March 30, 2017 - link

    Could you contradict yourself anymore? If it's not a fashion accessory to you, STOP YOUR WHINING ABOUT SYMMETRY. I believe we've all found the real tool. Reply
  • UglyFrank - Wednesday, March 29, 2017 - link

    I'm not sure why you've had to replace the battery several times? I've had mine since 2014 and it is still capable of similar endurance to when I first got it. It even surprises me on occasion (e.g. the rare days where I get 6hrs SOT) Reply
  • halcyon - Wednesday, March 29, 2017 - link

    Depends on what kind of battery you get. My note3 1st battery sucked really fast. 2nd has gone 2+ years and tons of recharge cycles.
    Not all batteries fall within the standard variation band. Of course you can always complain, and then they take your phone, wipe all your data, remove your screen protector and make you wait 4 weeks for the repairs (happened with my samsung).
    Reply
  • ddriver - Wednesday, March 29, 2017 - link

    That's highly doubtful, even if your phone spent 99.99% sleeping.

    There are other reasons to want a replaceable battery aside from replacing the stock one when it craps out. You could get a "recharge in a minute" - have a spare charged battery or two with you, very useful if you have a long day out or are somewhere remote hiking. You could get an oversized battery with a custom back.

    Besides, with the option of user replaceable battery your device can last that much longer, provided you don't break it. I bought my note 3 with 2 batteries, got another 3 recently at a bargain, they were phasing out old stock. Which means this phone will be usable for many years to come, which is a good thing since it is not like it is getting obsolete - it is perfectly capable of doing what it is supposed to. And I actually use it as a computer, I run DAQ, VPL and diagnostics software on it. Absolutely NOT looking forward to replacing it. The SD card slot is indispensable too, although I wish it was hot-pluggable.
    Reply
  • Reflex - Wednesday, March 29, 2017 - link

    If your battery is LiPo it's generally not going to lose a significant amount of charge capacity in the phone's usable lifetime. It's why there has been a move towards LiPo. I have several phones at this point that have not demonstrated significant battery life loss despite being years old, including my daily driver. Reply
  • negusp - Thursday, March 30, 2017 - link

    Stop spreading misinformation. lipo and lion have generally insignificant differences in terms of charge and degradation. Reply
  • Reflex - Thursday, March 30, 2017 - link

    That is not actually true in practice. LiPO batteries were not adopted more quickly because they have lower energy density. As power efficiency has increased, LiPO has been adopted because the tradeoff for lower energy density has been increased durability. They are also generally safer and able to be shaped in ways LiON cannot be. This was pointed out back when Apple went through the transition on the MacBook line. It has been a consideration on the mobile products I've worked on as well. Reply
  • mkozakewich - Wednesday, March 29, 2017 - link

    Honestly, an external USB battery would be just as good, and can be shared across many different phones. It also doesn't require you to turn your phone off. It's a better idea than swapping out your battery. Reply
  • Reflex - Wednesday, March 29, 2017 - link

    To be fair, there is a use case for swappable batteries. Chaining a external USB battery off of your phone sucks if you are using your phone to take photos or videos for instance. USB batteries can cause travel complications as well (depends on airline/airport) and you have to have a cable in your pocket. I agree that it's a solution, but I can see the case for swappable batteries for some scenarios.

    That said, degraded battery life is a remnant of the days when most phones had LiON batteries that degraded quickly. Most mid to high end phones now use LiPO which degrades far less quickly making the ability to easily swap a battery less valuable (especially if it forces compromise on size/weight/durability/water resistance).

    Something I've noticed is that people do not take into consideration their usage profile and how it changes over time as they have a phone. They assume their battery is failing when in reality they likely have half a dozen messenger apps, some OS customizations, and background processes that of course weren't there in the first few months when they got the phone. Most often when people claim to get a great improvement in battery life from swapping to a new battery I find that they also reset the phone to factory not realizing that the restored battery life was due to the reset clearing out cruft more than the battery they replaced.
    Reply
  • voicequal - Thursday, March 30, 2017 - link

    My Galaxy S4 battery swelled like a marshmallow at 3.5 yrs old. It still held a respectable charge right up to the day it failed. Replaced it no problem with a (probably knock-off) Samsung battery from Ebay. Looks like this phone is going to last another 3 yrs. Reply
  • twtech - Thursday, March 30, 2017 - link

    I can't say with certainty that it was strictly necessary - I believed that my battery life per charge had dropped somewhat significantly and wanted to restore it to what rt was like when the phone was new.

    We know that these batteries lose capacity with each charge, and that running them low/completely out further degrades that capacity. So over time, having those things happen - GPS for example can empty the battery pretty quick - it seemed like time for a replacement. About $20 on Amazon for a replacement, takes less than a minute to swap it out.
    Reply
  • BrokenCrayons - Wednesday, March 29, 2017 - link

    The specs are nice, but the design is sorely lacking. I'd happily accept a 4.5 inch (ideally 4 inch) screen at some more rational resolution well below 1080 to regain bezels for a screen protector and added thickness for a user replacable battery. DeX looks interesting though. Android has come a long way and this might be a good desktop PC replacement for the vast majority of mundane PC tasks. Reply
  • shabby - Wednesday, March 29, 2017 - link

    The galaxy s1 is the perfect phone for you, go back to the future and be amazed with a 4" screen and replaceable battery! Reply
  • BrokenCrayons - Wednesday, March 29, 2017 - link

    The S1 lacks a modern OS and SoC. It also doesn't include DeX which, for me, would be a big deal since it'd be really nice to get a phone and then dump a desktop or laptop in the process. I've used a single core LG Optimus V as a PC replacement. It didn't have a means to push an image to an external screen which, when you've got just a 3.2 inch display, makes word processing a bit of a drag despite having a good keyboard. Tablets, on the other hand, are simply too large to be easily tucked into a pocket so they make a poor choice for mobile computing. A flexible phone sized platform would be the best way to solve that problem, but Samsung missed the mark by sealing the battery inside and making the S8 too large to carry in anything less than a purse or one of those silly looking belt holsters. It's borderline tablet sized at 5.8 inches even without a big bezel. Reply
  • Belard - Thursday, March 30, 2017 - link

    There is an Android phone on the market that has a 4"screen that looks like an iPhone 4 clone. It's $90 at Best buy. IMHO... Any thing above 5" is too big.

    Wife feels that 5.5" is too small... For a screen. Ugh
    Reply
  • BrokenCrayons - Friday, March 31, 2017 - link

    Thanks for the tip. I'm probably going to need one sooner or later so I've been getting a bit more interested in shopping around for a new phone. I do agree completely with you that +5" is really too large. Yeah added screen size is nice, but there's a point where they become too large to manage easily. Reply
  • Lord-Bryan - Wednesday, March 29, 2017 - link

    "Android has come a long way and this might be a good desktop PC replacement for the vast majority of mundane PC tasks"
    This must be a joke or something, cause you need to go find out why and tablets suck and this will suck for the same reason, and cost you 99$ more and a monitor. Just look at that setup, it looks weird.
    Reply
  • BrokenCrayons - Wednesday, March 29, 2017 - link

    The arrangement was done to demonstrate functionality for a video. Other arrangements would obviously be made for someone using those capabilities that wasn't concerned with camera angles and visibility. All of those parts and pieces can be moved around or placed on a different, more suitable desk. I'm sort of surprised that wouldn't be outwardly obvious right away given the context of the demonstration.

    By nature of owning a computer, I also happen to own a monitor. Again, it's surprising that wouldn't be apparent given the nature of the website we're both reading.

    As for your feelings about how this "will suck" -- that's an opinion and you're welcome to have it, but it might be wise to support it with evidence or at least get a bit more specific. Given your clear misses about the monitor and desk arrangement, I suppose you're just reacting to stimulus rather than thinking before responding.
    Reply
  • Lord-Bryan - Wednesday, March 29, 2017 - link

    Hope it replaces your desktop workloads, or maybe you will just watch videos, browse, open PDFs Reply
  • BrokenCrayons - Thursday, March 30, 2017 - link

    I've already done it once before with a much smaller/less capable LG Optimus V (600Mhz single core, 320MB RAM, 3.2 inch screen, 170MB or so of onboard storage and a 16GB microSD card) and a Bluetooth keyboard when I tried traveling with just a phone. It worked pretty well, hanging out in a hotel room after work pecking out a few pages in a book I was writing at the time, fetching e-mail, web surfing, and playing a couple of games on a Game Boy emulator. The big drawback was the smaller screen and the single-tasking nature of the OS, but it was totally managable for the vast majority of what I wanted to do on a PC (creative writing, communication, and entertainment). I still own that little phone today though it hasn't had cell service for years. I use it for many of the same things I used to before when I don't feel like turning on my laptop. Reply
  • Rod_Serling_Lives - Saturday, April 01, 2017 - link

    DeX is DOA. I know people get all excited and hopeful at the promise of their phone docking and becoming a desktop PC, but it is a pipe dream right now. The Galaxy sells on name, display and camera. It is good at those things. I applaud them increasing feature sets, but they aren't very compelling outside of the S-Pen in the Note Series. Reply
  • Mavendependency - Wednesday, March 29, 2017 - link

    The G6 has a chamfered display, once you get it, it is pretty much un-seeable. Reply
  • goatfajitas - Wednesday, March 29, 2017 - link

    Not bad but I would have preferred to stay at 16x9. I love the smaller bezels, but would rather just have a shorter phone than adding length where it wasnt really needed. Reply
  • mkozakewich - Wednesday, March 29, 2017 - link

    It didn't really add length. They're replacing the dead face with active screen area. On the whole, I'd support a screen full of display with the on-screen buttons taking up none of the 16:9 'main' area. Reply
  • goatfajitas - Thursday, March 30, 2017 - link

    I meant adding length to the screen. I would have preferred to just keep a 16x9 screen and have a shorter phone. Reply
  • zeeBomb - Wednesday, March 29, 2017 - link

    Well thank you leaks! The fingerprint and finish of the phone tho... Reply
  • lilmoe - Wednesday, March 29, 2017 - link

    AMOLED+ is back yo Reply
  • supraman21 - Wednesday, March 29, 2017 - link

    I think the plus is for the extra resolution and not because of a RGB subpixel structure. It's sad that they are more than likely sticking with pentile. Reply
  • lilmoe - Wednesday, March 29, 2017 - link

    I wasn't talking about the extra resolution. The screen, according to the leaks, is most probably an RGB sub-pixel arrangement (AKA AMOLED+). Wonder why they didn't mention that. Reply
  • Meteor2 - Wednesday, March 29, 2017 - link

    To be honest at these resolutions, true or effective, you're not going to notice the pixel arrangement. Reply
  • supraman21 - Wednesday, March 29, 2017 - link

    I definitely notice it with the color red. Also I notice dithering/colorbanding because of the way that pentile structures the pixels. Reply
  • lilmoe - Wednesday, March 29, 2017 - link

    Displays aren't only about sharpness. I'd still lower the resolution on that screen yet still enjoy superior characteristics to anything available in the market for some time to come. Reply
  • lilmoe - Sunday, April 02, 2017 - link

    Nope :(
    Still pentile............
    Reply
  • lilmoe - Wednesday, March 29, 2017 - link

    Bixby should be called a VUI (voice user interface). Looks like they nailed voice. Bravo! Reply
  • stanleyipkiss - Wednesday, March 29, 2017 - link

    Why no dedicated 3.5mm jack output for Dex? Why connect a monitor, Ethernet and more and not have a pair of speakers or some headphones? Reply
  • hechacker1 - Wednesday, March 29, 2017 - link

    Well, interesting looking. I like the lack of bezels. Not happy about the fingerprint sensor location though.

    I'm going to guess right now that the iPhone 8 looks almost exactly like this, except its home button will remain on the front, and the camera placement will remain off center.
    Reply
  • osxandwindows - Wednesday, March 29, 2017 - link

    The iphone 8 won't have an edge to edge display, tho. Reply
  • Meteor2 - Wednesday, March 29, 2017 - link

    Well it might. The rumoured-to-death 10.5" iPad is supposed to have little or no bezels, even though Apple previously said they'd keep bezels the size they are so people can actually hold tablet computers (I find that useful). Reply
  • Drumsticks - Wednesday, March 29, 2017 - link

    "Regardless, it’s disappointing that Samsung is still prioritizing thickness over battery life."

    This is going to continue until we start getting some real push back, driven, initially probably, by the media.

    Seriously Smartphone performance has increased probably nearly an order of magnitude since 2011-12, but we have hardly gotten out of the 1 day of battery life. I seriously think we could tolerate another 2mm of depth in the phone, and I wish the media would make it a bigger deal if you really feel the same way.

    Regardless, though, thanks for the hands on! Samsung continues to not be right for me, but the S8 looks like an impressive enough piece of hardware all things considered that should do well for them. I'm a little bit worried about the battery life, with a bigger display, higher resolution, and smaller battery, but I guess we will see.
    Reply
  • halcyon - Wednesday, March 29, 2017 - link

    Almost all the Chinese competition is doing 4000+ mAh batteris for years now. And their units are just as small, just as light and they don't constantly blow up. And some of them have dual cameras and QHD+ Amoled displays too. Samsung has NO excuse, except pinching pennies. The same for their abysmal flash storage space (all the major competition has gone up to 128/256GB, Samsung in still stuck at 64GB). Reply
  • 0iron - Wednesday, March 29, 2017 - link

    I think it's more due to the weight. At 155g, it's at certainly upper limit of 'normal' size phone's weight. 173g is also right weight for phablet size. Bigger battery capacity will make total weight less than ideal.

    Xiaomi Redmi 4 have a 4100mAh battery at 156g.
    Reply
  • Notmyusualid - Friday, March 31, 2017 - link

    @ 0iron

    It IS weight, also in my opinion, my Samsung A9 Pro has a 5000mAh battery, but it is 210g.

    http://www.gsmarena.com/samsung_galaxy_a9_pro_(201...

    I only put up with it as I was carrying two phones before, which obviously weighed more than 210g.
    Reply
  • Meteor2 - Wednesday, March 29, 2017 - link

    I think it's too soon to say that Samsung haven't prioritised battery life. Maybe these 10 nm node chips and their new uarches will mean even longer battery lives than before on 3 Ah batteries. When you've got wireless charging and QC, how much battery do you really need? I'm not saying you wouldn't like more, just i that I don't think these phones are badly compromised. Reply
  • lilmoe - Wednesday, March 29, 2017 - link

    The DeX interface looks pretty darn fluid and seamless, very fast and responsive too. Definitely looks like a well thought out feature. Love it. But are phone calls managed while docked? Did you get a chance to see that? Is it possible to launch that mode wirelessly and use the phone as a remote touch pad like Windows' implementation? Reply
  • fanofanand - Wednesday, March 29, 2017 - link

    This was a refreshing review. Honest criticism without the fanboyishness oftentimes communicated by the "other" mobile phone reviewer. Reply
  • halcyon - Wednesday, March 29, 2017 - link

    Did anybody get the impression: wow, nice screen, interesting ratio - meh about the rest?
    Bixby is work in progress, unproven. Camera is last years single sensor same-o (good enough, but nothing to wow). Nothing special on the audio front (vs. G6 Quad Dac in Asia models). No dual sensors. No big storage space. No big battery. Awkward fingerprint sensor placement.

    The whole phone is a great placeholder for an ad titled "Wait till Note8 with better screen, dual cam, more memory and lots of other goodies!"

    At 929€, it's a definite pass for me.
    Reply
  • arayoflight - Wednesday, March 29, 2017 - link

    Audio will be nice I guess. All the exynos models always had the wolfson DAC. Qualcomm versions traditionally blow though. Storage space is plenty with the 64GB base option with microSD slot.

    It's a pass for me too, with that mediocre battery capacity and the same camera. But the rest of the phone looks awesome. UFS 2.1 storage too seems nice.
    Reply
  • more-or-less - Wednesday, March 29, 2017 - link

    Who the 'eck needs dual cam? Do you see professional grade camera or any cameras using dual sensor? Just because apple shoved up your arse doesn't mean everyone wants a dual cam. A good single sensor is way better than crappy dual sensor. Idiots like you rest of humans look dumb as fuck. Reply
  • osxandwindows - Wednesday, March 29, 2017 - link

    So, how's the pay? Reply
  • halcyon - Wednesday, March 29, 2017 - link

    I've used Mate9 with dual camera and it's really nice. And superior in zoom, in b/w photography and also excellent in low-light if you use manual mode.
    Further, Huawei already ships 128GB and 256GB internal flash models along with microsd-card slot. I can easily max out the 64GB on my phone (and I already have a 256GB sdcard).
    Yes, I'm a power user. Go ahead, sue me :-D
    Reply
  • lilmoe - Wednesday, March 29, 2017 - link

    hmmmm. The phone is pretty darn impressive though, and will most probably be the best in 2017 until the Note8 is announced. The crap load of leaks took too much of the excitement away, since we already knew everything about it.

    About the specs....
    - Processor: This is as good as it will get this year for the SoC. I don't believe anything better will come out, definitely not from Apple at least (might be contempt with fixing their cluster migration issues and go HMT).
    - Screen is the absolute best. AMOLED+ is back. Hope to see better upscaling of lower resolution presets.
    - Build is stunning.
    - Radio stack should be the best in the business.
    - Software and hardware processing improvements in the camera, probably same sensor (still best in class).
    - We still have no information about the speaker and DAC. Seemed much loader and fuller from what I've heard from the DaX demo. Will have to see reviews and test it in hand.
    - Battery life needs to be tested.
    - User interface is awesome.
    - I wouldn't call Bixby a work in progress. I believe they totally nailed what I want from voice interaction. Very nice.

    Would I upgrade? Most probably not (unless I find a massive discount by the end of the year). Pretty sure most of the software improvements and Bixby will find its way to my Exynos GS7, which is already better than anything out there especially after the Nougat update (including the G6 from LG). I mostly use my camera in manual mode anyway (lowest ISO possible) which takes photos much, MUCH better than anything out there.

    I would have been more enticed to upgrade if:
    - the processor had an improved little cluster (efficiency cores). I was hoping they'd have swapped the A53s with Exynos M2 cores optimized for lower frequency and much lower power consumption. 10nm would have made that possible and a bit more feasible, I believe.
    - an even better ISP that allowed a larger 16-18mp camera sensor (larger in both size and pixel count) with more improved noise processing and super sampling of the entire image for video (whole sensor readout). They're currently keeping it at 12mp to keep the image processing as optimal as possible for video, without needing to crop the image or do any form of pixel binning.
    - A f1.4 lens. Even better, I wonder of they can pull off a retractable zoom lens (18-55 or 24-70mm at fixed f1.4 aperture) in the same form factor, where the lens retracts to sit flush with the back when the camera isn't active. THAT would be the next revolution smartphone photography without needing any dual sensor gimmicks. But I guess they'll need to invent in nano gear for that.
    Reply
  • Meteor2 - Wednesday, March 29, 2017 - link

    Yes I was surprised to see A53 cores *still* knocking around in there. Perhaps the A35 just isn't significantly more efficient. It's probably only a a few percent better for something that does only a few percent of the total CPU work. Reply
  • lilmoe - Thursday, March 30, 2017 - link

    The small cluster does most of the work actually. Reply
  • negusp - Thursday, March 30, 2017 - link

    "Build is stunning"? You mean a thin glass brick?

    And, until Samsung ditches their policy of never releasing kernel source for their devices, they're pretty much worthless as a company to me.
    Reply
  • lilmoe - Thursday, March 30, 2017 - link

    I was obviously talking about the design. The form factor, the front and the screen that assimilates with that front (especially in the dark), the sides and the chrome finish of the metal frame are all absolutely gorgeous.

    I just wish there was a "Classic" variant with a semi-rubberized plastic back and a removable battery... They can do this with water resistance just like the GS5. I would have probably argued that there wasn't enough demand for that now, but we do have the relatively unpopular Active series, right?. Common Sammy :(

    "And, until Samsung ditches their policy of never releasing kernel source for their devices, they're pretty much worthless as a company to me"
    The wont because of Knox and other reasons, but I don't want them to. You shouldn't either. This just means that backdoors and security holes will be that much easier to find. At this point, there software is already comprehensive that it isn't worth rooting anymore, risking bricking or instability...

    If you're dead set on custom firmware for whatever, this isn't your phone.
    Reply
  • Meteor2 - Thursday, March 30, 2017 - link

    It's £689 in the UK. That is a ridiculous price. I was surprised to see Google is still charging £599 for the Pixel when I checked just now, too.

    I know several people with iPhone 7s and a few with Nexus phones. The rest generally use old (2+ years) Samsungs or iPhones. I've never seen a Pixel. I do wonder if we are hitting or even passing the limit of what people are prepared to pay for something which, after all, weighs less than 160g.

    The specifications and tech in this phone is first class... But you'd be mad to buy it over a OnePlus.
    Reply
  • Eden-K121D - Wednesday, March 29, 2017 - link

    Totally meh. Reply
  • mrochester - Wednesday, March 29, 2017 - link

    It would be great to see these running iOS. Hopefully the iPhone will end up looking like these. Reply
  • Meteor2 - Thursday, March 30, 2017 - link

    Would it though? I had an iOS phone from work for a while. They utterly such compared to Android 7. It's just... Rather hard to actually get a phone running 7. Reply
  • ToTTenTranz - Wednesday, March 29, 2017 - link

    Isn't this using Samsung's LPDDR4X? Reply
  • hojnikb - Wednesday, March 29, 2017 - link

    So normal, non curvy screens are now bust on highend phones ? Reply
  • osxandwindows - Wednesday, March 29, 2017 - link

    no. Reply
  • halcyon - Wednesday, March 29, 2017 - link

    Nope, not from LG (G6), Sony (XZ premium), Huawei (Mate 9, P10, P10 plus), Xiaomi (Mi Mix) or Reply
  • lilmoe - Wednesday, March 29, 2017 - link

    "a representative told us that while the 8895 comes with a Mali-G71MP20 GPU, the GPU configuration and operating points are set by the OEM"

    What OEM? You mean SDI customers? Was he talking about Samsung Mobile in particular or other Chinese OEMs?
    Reply
  • Matt Humrick - Wednesday, March 29, 2017 - link

    Samsung Mobile primarily, but other phone OEMs (notably Meizu) will probably use E8895 too. Samsung LSI is also targeting VR HMDs and automotive applications. Reply
  • lilmoe - Thursday, March 30, 2017 - link

    Thanks for the reply. It would be really nice if you guys can write up a deep dive showdown between the Exynos and Snapdragon (both the variants and SoCs), with emphasis on efficiency, power draw, and GPU comparisons.

    An extensive deep drive of the screen technology would also be highly appreciated. Especially max APL, dynamic range analysis of HDR and color volume (if you have the means), compared to the GS7 and other leading LCDs (like Apple's P3 screens).

    Please, PLEASE make this your top priority. Everyone else on the web does extensive test of everything else.
    Reply
  • lilmoe - Thursday, March 30, 2017 - link

    ***with emphasis on efficiency, power draw, and GPU comparisons in conjunction with common everyday workloads.

    It would also be nice to log the clocks for the CPU/GPU and compare them against each other, and calculate the average clocks of both platforms.
    Reply
  • Meteor2 - Thursday, March 30, 2017 - link

    IIRC the Snapdragon deep-dive was a work in progress being worked on by Andrei until he left. As he's now gone Anandtech aren't going to do SoC deep-dives anymore. Personally they went over my head but they were unique to this site. Reply
  • lilmoe - Thursday, March 30, 2017 - link

    huh?

    http://www.anandtech.com/show/11088/hisilicon-kiri...
    Reply
  • Matt Humrick - Thursday, March 30, 2017 - link

    We will continue to examine SoC performance and efficiency, and I have a number of such projects in my queue. Unfortunately, I'm the only person we have focusing on mobile right now, which limits the amount of content we can produce. Reply
  • lilmoe - Thursday, March 30, 2017 - link

    Your hard work is really appreciated. I really hope you dedicate a good amount of time on the new SoCs. Since both SoCs have the same phone, same process node, same amount of cores, same OEM skin, it should provide for the most apples to apples comparison we can get.

    Please try your best to get your hands on both variants. It would be nice to compare javascript and browser performance of both SoCs on Samsung's browser since its better optimized than Chrome.
    Reply
  • Meteor2 - Wednesday, March 29, 2017 - link

    Hmmm, well, I'm going to say it: this looks amazing.

    DeX looks incredible. Like Continuum but slicker and, you know, available. I was watching the demo (very nice videos, btw Anandtech) and thinking that this could replace my laptop. Ok it couldn't really but it's damned close. I really hope Google responds -- they've got to crack on with merging Android and ChromeOS.

    Bixby is rather good too. I'm intrigued that they've included Google Assistant as well.

    I'm glad they've kept the same camera module rather than descend into pixel wars.

    I'm amazed anyone is saying 'meh' about the design. Yeah the back is ugly but the front is not. That screen to body ratio is superb.

    One question: is WPA and PMA wireless charging the same as Qi and Rezence?
    Reply
  • Lord-Bryan - Wednesday, March 29, 2017 - link

    Seriously this could replace your laptop.
    I don't know what you do on your laptop, but it seems like you don't do much
    Reply
  • Meteor2 - Wednesday, March 29, 2017 - link

    I'm guessing you didn't read my *very next sentence*. Reply
  • Aerodrifting - Wednesday, March 29, 2017 - link

    I highly doubt you will get good battery life with a combination of 2960x1440 screen and 3000mAh battery, I am glad I didn't wait and went with the Oneplus 3T instead, Absolutely no regrets here Reply
  • beginner99 - Wednesday, March 29, 2017 - link

    On-Screen buttons? No thank you. Main reason to get Samsung was off-screen buttons. Now I can just a swell buy a cheap-o knock-off. Reply
  • halcyon - Wednesday, March 29, 2017 - link

    Yes, I wonder how all those people are going to use their phones in Korean winter at sub-zero temps with thick gloves on... Not everybody lives in California. I really like physical buttons and "glove touch display" has never really worked for me. Reply
  • lilmoe - Wednesday, March 29, 2017 - link

    It's force sensitive. You can wake the device by force touching the button area (which should also be always on, akin to the always on display).
    You're not sacrificing screen real estate since that's what the elongated screen is all about...
    Reply
  • beginner99 - Monday, April 03, 2017 - link

    But you are hence also not gaining any screen. A larger bezel with buttons is then superior to this. Reply
  • HomeworldFound - Wednesday, March 29, 2017 - link

    I need the button, or at least a touch sensitive fingerprint scanner button. When the software crashes or stalls on android, the on-screen buttons go with it. It's easier just to tap the sensor twice and wait. Reply
  • Meteor2 - Thursday, March 30, 2017 - link

    I've not had an Android phone crash since Android 2. Reply
  • Rod_Serling_Lives - Saturday, April 01, 2017 - link

    Thats great...for you. Reply
  • dstarr3 - Wednesday, March 29, 2017 - link

    I was really hoping Samsung was going to learn their lesson and go back to removeable batteries. So much for that. Still rocking my S4, because it still works, because I was able to replace the battery. Reply
  • lesbaer45 - Wednesday, March 29, 2017 - link

    Looks like I hang onto my S5 again waiting for the S9. No removable battery is a killer for me as well. Guess they didn't learn from the Note 7.

    At least it still has a SD card slot.
    Reply
  • lilmoe - Thursday, March 30, 2017 - link

    Ain't gonna happen. As much as we love removable batteries and plastic backs, the market and media (thanks for nothing folks) voted otherwise. Reply
  • Filiprino - Wednesday, March 29, 2017 - link

    I wonder if they will use spanish for the european market instead of mexican. The Galaxy S2 I owned had S-Voice in mexican instead of spanish. Reply
  • SydneyBlue120d - Wednesday, March 29, 2017 - link

    Any info ABOUT unlimited HEVC 2160p60 encoding support? Maybe only the Exynos version? Reply
  • Cliff34 - Wednesday, March 29, 2017 - link

    DeX sounds to me like Continuum but is it practical? If it is a desktop, i would get a computer. But i can see this is useful if i am going to a cafe and need to do some heavy productivity of a desktop and the phone can do this...probably just need a big screen for the phone to display. Reply
  • syxbit - Wednesday, March 29, 2017 - link

    Very curious to see Exynos in action. So far Snapdragon 835 isn't the runaway many were expecting. It's sometimes better, sometimes worse than SD821. As Samsung seem to be taking a more iterative approach, their Exynos should only be better than the last. Reply
  • virtuastro - Wednesday, March 29, 2017 - link

    @Matt Humrick

    I don't know if it was you who made this video, it was awesome and quality delivery on video. Well done! Hopefully, Anandtech need more videos on this site.
    Reply
  • Matt Humrick - Wednesday, March 29, 2017 - link

    Thanks! Yes, I recorded the video with some editing help from Purch's video group. Sorry about the scratchy sounding audio. I was using the fixed focal length lens I use for still pics and it kept making small aperture adjustments. I also have a cheap zoom lens, but it's not as good in low light.

    > Anandtech need more videos on this site.

    Our video efforts to date have been....lacking.
    Reply
  • Meteor2 - Thursday, March 30, 2017 - link

    Agree, excellent videos. Reply
  • Meteor2 - Thursday, March 30, 2017 - link

    You might want a better directional mic though; Rode make good ones. Reply
  • prime2515103 - Wednesday, March 29, 2017 - link

    I pulled the battery from my Note 3 (after less than 2 years) and found that it was bulging to the point that I feel like I dodged a bullet. Between that, and people I know wondering why their battery dies 75% faster compared to new, I will never buy another phone without a replaceable battery (maybe at under $50 I would). I suppose a new battery tech will come out eventually but if I can't replace the battery, they better put a 5-year warranty on it at a minimum.

    A $750-$850 disposable phone just isn't for me.
    Reply
  • Dazedconfused - Wednesday, March 29, 2017 - link

    These comments always confuse me. I got my old HTC M7 Battery replaced with genuine part in 10 minutes for $60 AUD at a local shop (after owning it 2 years). It's not that much more than buying the genuine part and was very little hassle. Reply
  • voicequal - Thursday, March 30, 2017 - link

    Did your old battery swell and deform the phone? A removable battery design usually detaches the back cover instead of crushing the phone from the inside. Reply
  • prime2515103 - Saturday, April 01, 2017 - link

    It didn't... I actually didn't know there was a problem until I decided to get a spare battery (which obviously is no longer a spare). I've had it in an Otterbox case since I got it so I noticed nothing. Reply
  • Rod_Serling_Lives - Saturday, April 01, 2017 - link

    People are free to enjoy what they want, but I agree with you. I paid $80 bucks to have my iPhone battery replaced on my 5 inside of an Apple store. It was quick and easy. My iPhone 6 still had 87 percent battery health before I traded it in for the iPhone 7. It was purchased brand new in 2014, so it wasn't like I saw that mortifying degradation. I understand why people like swappable batteries, but I don't see the huge hullabaloo about it. Reply
  • prime2515103 - Saturday, April 01, 2017 - link

    I replaced mine for $15 and didn't even have to leave my house. I guess I'm spoiled. Reply
  • prime2515103 - Saturday, April 01, 2017 - link

    I replaced the battery in my Note 3 with a genuine Samsung battery, at home, for $15 USD. Reply
  • Notmyusualid - Sunday, April 02, 2017 - link

    I'm puzzled anyone could still be using a HTC M7 (my favourite phone to date), due to the short battery life, and the worse charge time (almost 4 hours).

    So I'll assume your daily usage needs are less than mine.
    Reply
  • lilmoe - Thursday, March 30, 2017 - link

    They're not disposable by any means. They're just much less practical and more cumbersome to service. Reply
  • amdwilliam1985 - Wednesday, March 29, 2017 - link

    Does anyone know if these phones the first to use UFS 2.1?
    Curious to see how it compares to UFS 2.0 in terms of performance.
    I believe iPhone got better ROM/NAND and RAM which probably help promote their snappy performance, maybe UFS 2.1 can make a difference along with LPDDR4.
    Reply
  • arayoflight - Thursday, March 30, 2017 - link

    I have confirmation from various sources that it is indeed UFS 2.1. Details about LPDDR4x vs LPDDR4 and sensor difference vs S7 are still scarce though. I guess we will know in due time.

    Weren't the Huawei mate 9 and P10 the first phones to use UFS 2.1?
    Reply
  • supraman21 - Friday, March 31, 2017 - link

    Its great that they are using UFS 2.1 but the better question is if they are using 1 or 2 lane. UFS 2.0 had a theoretical speed of up to 1.2 GB/S with 2 lanes but only single was used. Reply
  • lilmoe - Thursday, March 30, 2017 - link

    They do come with UFS 2.1 according to Samsung's spec sheet:
    https://www.sammobile.com/2017/03/30/this-is-samsu...

    Not sure if they're the _first_ to have it though. The Chinese are adopting newer tech fast too.
    Reply
  • royalcrown - Thursday, March 30, 2017 - link

    "The curved rear glass makes the phones easier to pick up and more comfortable to hold"...

    Solution >= don't have tiny bitch hands. Pwn.
    Reply
  • 3ogdy - Thursday, March 30, 2017 - link

    I don't agree with the fact that one could touch the camera when the intention was to touch the fingerprint scanner. It has edges and, holding the phone in the right hand allows the index finger to reach the fingerprint scanner first. It's actually the best position it could've had.
    I don't agree when you say it's EASIER to grab the phone from the table if it's curved. It's HARDER to do so because without proper edges (closer to 90º angle) it's easier for the fingers to slip while trying to grab the phone. Right after reading that I've tried doing it with an SGS3 and the more curved area (screen facing the table, downwards) makes it more difficult to grab the phone. It's not an advantage, it's a problem, albeit a really negligible one.
    It's disappointing that Samsung is still prioritizing thickness over battery life. That's so true. I couldn't give a damn if the phone was thicker - as long as it had a bigger battery. The problem is non user-replaceable batteries cannot be replaced with aftermarket higher capacity ones that just increase the thickness of the phone and come with their own cover. Thank God for microSD.
    Reply
  • Matt Humrick - Thursday, March 30, 2017 - link

    Have you held a Galaxy S8/S8+ in your hand? I have. The fingerprint sensor is more difficult to reach, especially so if you're left handed. The S8+ is even worse, because the sensor is even higher on the back, making it a real stretch to even get your finger up that high. There is not a noticeable difference in feel between the camera and sensor either, other than the camera is larger.

    Have you ever tried to pickup a Galaxy S6 edge from a table? Very difficult. The rounded corners on the front leave you with almost no aluminum edge to grip, and the thin edge basically sits flush with the table because of the flat back. The rounded back edges on the S7 and S8 allow the meaty part of your fingertip to wrap around the edge and get under the phone just enough to help you get a better grip.
    Reply
  • Belard - Thursday, March 30, 2017 - link

    On top of that. It still seems stupid to make a phone with a glass back. They still crack. Apple stopped doing glass 3 generations ago. Reply
  • Notmyusualid - Sunday, April 02, 2017 - link

    @ Belard

    Whilst I'm not a conspirists, I do believe anything to sell more phones (understand from a companies' point of view), is fine by them.

    The more delicate / fragile a phone is, is a boon for repair & replacement business.
    Reply
  • SydneyBlue120d - Thursday, March 30, 2017 - link

    Everything seems to be really good, however I'm much more interested in the Sony Xperia XZ Premium. Reply
  • arayoflight - Thursday, March 30, 2017 - link

    Matt, s8 uses IMX333, not IMX260. Correct it please. Reply
  • Matt Humrick - Thursday, March 30, 2017 - link

    Source? Reply
  • lilmoe - Thursday, March 30, 2017 - link

    These guys have an AIDA64 screenshot.

    https://www.sammobile.com/2017/03/30/samsung-is-so...
    Reply
  • sharath.naik - Friday, March 31, 2017 - link

    No bezel + Case pointless. No bezel - case pointless. I understand thin bezel but wrap around screen? why? no one in the right mind will not have to buy a case for this. And please samsung I need a upgrade to note 4, that is keeping everything same (replaceable battery, sdcard, removable back) but adding Fingerprint reader and updated processor that's it and I am reserving one. May be a thinner bezel, but no wrap around bezel please. Reply
  • zxcvbad - Friday, March 31, 2017 - link

    Would be great to see Exynos 8895 review in details, especially all the current SPEC apps and benchmarks exposing M1s instead of M2s: http://bit.ly/2oHfb1N Reply
  • lilmoe - Monday, April 03, 2017 - link

    They are M2s, these apps need to be updated to show the newer cores. How much different the M2 is compared to the M1, however, is another question. Reply
  • zxcvbad - Friday, March 31, 2017 - link

    Here's reply of AIDA64 developer:
    "Well… Indeed they seem to use the same M1 core. M1 core is detected by its ARM part ID, which is simply 1 for M1. I don't think Samsung forgot to update the ARM part ID :)"
    Reply
  • oranos - Friday, March 31, 2017 - link

    100% needs a Dbrand skin to cover up that BUSTED ASS fcc logo on the back Reply
  • Rod_Serling_Lives - Saturday, April 01, 2017 - link

    No one should be making excuses for the fingerprint sensor placement. It is lazy design for a flagship or any device for that matter. I predominantly use my phone in the left hand and this is a non-starter for me. It is even difficult to grasp with the right hand and will result in many a smudged camera lens.

    I carry an iPhone as my personal and Android as a work device. In terms of upgrading my S7 Edge, this glaring issue with ergonomics is most definitely pushing me towards a G6 or the XZ Premium.
    Reply
  • HardwareDufus - Saturday, April 01, 2017 - link

    If this phone had dual sim dual active, and both worked at 4G LTE speeds... I'd jump off the Windows 10 Mobile and re-gift my 950XL. You get to keep your MS Apps/Eco-System while enjoying all those other apps available to android but not winmob.

    This is a flagship phone for 2017!
    Reply
  • Freeda Bees - Saturday, April 01, 2017 - link

    Matt:

    Do you have any information on the micro SD? I had rather expected to see Samsung deploy their new UFS Micro SD card on this phone, along with the socket they have developed which can accept both the new cards and the legacy micro CD cards.
    Reply
  • VSingularity - Sunday, April 02, 2017 - link

    "Shrinking the size of the lower bezel required relocating the fingerprint sensor to the back. Instead of placing it below the rear camera like we see on most other phones, Samsung places it next to the flush-mounted camera, which is less than ideal."

    Really? Is this the author's opinion, or is that what Samsung reps would like us to believe?

    "I suspect people will turn to the iris scanner or the new face unlock feature, which uses the front camera for facial recognition after pressing the power button, to overcome the poor fingerprint sensor placement."

    A far more sensible explanation is that in the hope their customers will use the iris scanner and facial recognition feature, Samsung deliberately discouraged use of the fingerprint sensor by placing it impossibly close to the rear camera. After all, the company already has the majority of their customers' thumbprint data. Unique Facial Recognition & Iris Scanning info of their customers? Not so much, yet...
    Reply
  • OzTheForester - Tuesday, April 04, 2017 - link

    I hope they will stop trading ergonomics with looks, I had to move from note4 to note7 then S7 Edge,
    each time I hold S7E I miss my note4, which was much much easier to hold and use. These new phones are innovative when it comes to inside but outside they have turned into extremely hard to hold, slippery, non-ergonomic, idiotic fashion objects. There has to be grips on the sides and back not glass or polished metal why nobody is complaining about that??
    Reply
  • shadarlo - Tuesday, April 04, 2017 - link

    I absolutely love the ability to hook the phone up and use it as a desktop. I wish google would bake this directly into Android though and provide a Chrome like desktop experience when in this mode.

    Even nicer would be if it did it purely wirelessly (which would take monitors to accept the wireless standard I know) or through USB-C and video passthrough while charging at the same time and connecting to the KB/Mouse via bluetooth.
    Reply
  • Ziich - Tuesday, April 04, 2017 - link

    The s8 uses a different sensor than the one found in the s7 while retaining the same resolution Reply
  • TechGizmo - Tuesday, April 04, 2017 - link

    The camera on the back is a Sony IMX 333 so it's not the same as the one on galaxy s7. Reply
  • beggerking@yahoo.com - Friday, April 07, 2017 - link

    s8 would totally replace s7 edge if they had put 3500mah battery in there... at 3000mah... i'm not so sure...

    s8 edge is just... unnecessarily too big..
    Reply
  • hassanltdd - Tuesday, April 11, 2017 - link

    Brand new Original Samsung Galaxy s8 and s8+ New Edition RED Apple iphone 7 and 7 128GB plus cost 550usd with 1year warranty.

    Serious buyer should contact us.
    Reply
  • Fidelator - Saturday, April 15, 2017 - link

    These so called machine learning virtual assistants are just hardly useful add-ons constantly running in the background wasting battery and RAM, tracking our behavior to sell the info and display targeted ads.

    These are hardly something good.
    Reply
  • Duke paps - Sunday, April 16, 2017 - link

    Despite the new 10nm chipset construction with power efficiency and some improve component power draws, a marginally large battery that could have held more mah won't have hurt though Reply
  • erdene32 - Saturday, April 22, 2017 - link

    SAMSUNG GALAXY S8 AVAILABLE FOR SALE
    Brand new phones
    Factory unlocked Facetime
    Company Protectors Still on it.
    Accessorries
    Charger Datacable.
    contact : erdene32@hotmail.com

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    Reply
  • loller86 - Sunday, April 23, 2017 - link

    But, you must understand that you are the dumbest pr*ck.

    The S8's feature LPDDR4X, not LPDDR4. This is very easy to confuse for a pr*ck like you.
    Reply

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